Adopting a pup. Training stategies?
Home > Home Recording Forum > Talkin' Smack > Adopting a pup. Training stategies?
Posted on Apr 08, 2011 09:21 pm
Quincysan
http://www.unitedmusicians.info
Contributor Since: Nov 11, 2007
I've been hankering to adopt a Great Dane since my buddy got a harlequin in college but have had reservations about owning a purebred dog due to the genetic nastiness that can ensue down the line. Just so happens there's a Great Dane Pit Bull cross that's up for adoption. I'll tell neighbors he's a Dane lab cross...hope to avoid the crap Hue had to go through. He's neutered and has all his shots. Supposedly a high energy dog, and I'm a high energy guy so it could work out between us I think.
Meeting him this weekend, hopefully. Owner has pretty much given me the greenlight. Want to walk him first of course, see what he's like. Got a big yard at the house I'm moving into in May. Anybody out there into dog training? I've had many dogs that were very well behaved but momma raised them with an iron fist. Seems like all these dog behaviorists are saying that 'positive motivation' is a better path to take (and believe that Cesar Milan and his tactics are 'brutal'? Really?). As much as I want to agree with the positive lovey stuff...part of me thinks this might be a bunch of arrogant humans anthropomorphizing their animals at their own expense. I'm certainly not going to kick his butt when he makes typical pup mistakes, but dogs seem to need an Alpha, and in nature the alpha dog doesn't hand out treats when the other dog submits...he also doesn't maul him to death. Just a mild physical assertion of dominance, right?
Thoughts?
[ Back to Top ]
olddogMember
Since: Jul 02, 2003
Apr 08, 2011 10:01 pm That's a great looking pup, definitley looks like He took more after the Dane side! I've had 3 Great Danes and IMO there is no better dog on the planet. Biggest problem with them is they are generally short lived, 7-8 years being the norm. The last one I had lived to 9 years.
As far as raising/training I think Cesar Milan has it right. When I was young I used to do like a lot of people training/disiplining my dogs and come down on them like the wrath of God (not cruely mind you :) but I've found a calm, assertive approach really does get quicker and better results.
I haven't raised my voice or hand to any of the dog's we've had over the last 20 years and they've been the best behaved and closest to perfect dogs imaginable. Right now we've got a Dane mix (dane & american bull dog supposedly) we picked up from a shelter and He's a great dog, very energetic and loving but slobbers too much (think hooch) LOL.
Dan
Apr 08, 2011 10:43 pm Nice pup! My advice is crate or cage!..I always thought that it was mean and abusive untill I tried it. Dogs love it! It gives them a sence of security. They don't think about it like you or I would. They love it, and it makes housbreaking a cakewalk.(pardon the pun). My dogs hang out in there all day. I only lock them at night, or when I'm gone. But it's their "safe place". Good luck. Pits are great dogs. They have a bad rap, because, for whatever reason, they are very popular among azzholes. Give him love and he will return it 10 fold. Good luck!
cruxTypo SzarMember
Since: Jul 04, 2002
Apr 08, 2011 11:02 pm U do have to assert urself like u and everyone else have said, set boundaries and use all kinds of motivation to get the msg across. My dog recently passed away, was very rough but she was the best I could have ever wanted, a mutt that just kind of stumbled onto us.
like u said, dogs need to know who the leader of the pack is and that is achieved by both showing that u can provide for them but also that u can overpower them if need be.
Apr 09, 2011 07:51 am Nice looking beast...very cool.
Yeah, poisitive reinforcement is good, but discipline is good too...I've had to establish myself asd the household alpha a couple times, not a big deal, and we have an incredible dog, we get compliments frequently from people walking by with their dogs about how well behaved our dog is (black lab/german shepherd).
Key's I have found is walking the border of your yard with a choker collar...when she crosses the line, give a tug...they'lllearn the border quick...never let the dog on furniture or to sleep with you, they HAVE to know you are the boss, not them. If they put their paw on your foot, they are establisging alpha status, pull your foot out and put it on their paw...some odd stuff, but it sends a message in their language.
Quincysanhttp://www.unitedmusicians.infoContributor
Since: Nov 11, 2007
Apr 09, 2011 11:43 am Thanks for the tips! I agree with everything said. Didn't know that the footsy behavior is a dominance thing. I'll watch for that. Going out to see him tomorrow, taking him for a walk/run around the block. See how it goes...
Very sorry to hear about your dog Crux. Always sucks when a great dog passes on. Always seems to happen too soon.
I'm a big believer in the pit bulls as well Big Blues. I do some work for a guy with a pitt occasionally. I always spend more time throwing tennis balls than working. :) All great experiences with great danes too. I think it will be a good mix. The neighborhood I'm moving into is kinda iffy so its nice to know that my girlfriend will have a tough dog around when I'm not home. When I saw that there was a registered sex offender across the street, I decided a big dog had to happen. Wanted one anyway, so it all should work out I think.
HuePinnipedal Czar (: 3= Member
Since: Apr 11, 2004
Apr 11, 2011 10:41 am Awesome! Some really good advice here. We got our Niro at age six, so cage-training was out of the question, however if/when I get another puppy, it would be cage-trained... it's the kind of structure in their lives that they appreciate... makes them more responsive, and eager to please.
Niro gets away with murder, compared to any other dog I've owned. Now at age eight, he's not the best of listeners. Considering age eight in 'dog years' is age fifty-eight in 'human-years', I'd say he listens about as good as I will at that age. = p
Yeah, big dogs are the way to go.(imo) I just can't stand the 'yap' of a small dog... too mid-heavy for my ears. Can't EQ a dog, though. haha
Apr 13, 2011 02:05 am I sure enjoyed the time with my doberman. And I'll 2nd the usefulness of crating. Once he was older the crate was taken away and rug was put in it's place and he still treated it as his safe zone til his last day. Oh yeah and be prepared because the dog usually does just a little training of his own.
Quincysanhttp://www.unitedmusicians.infoContributor
Since: Nov 11, 2007
Apr 13, 2011 02:27 pm So I met the pup! Good dog for the most part, but he doesn't get enough exercise and based on what I've read in "The Dog Listener" by Jan Fennell, he definitely considers himself the alpha of the household (or at least a contender). Using some tactics mentioned in the book I got him in line pretty quickly and had him walking at a heel with success, thankfully. It was not easy to resist his urges to play tug of war with the leash, hah. Trouble is, before the successful walk happened he jumped up and nipped me, then nipped my girlfriend twice. He left some bite marks in me (nothing serious, will be healed up before the weekend I'm sure). He wasn't being aggressive, but he was displaying some well documented signs of dominance. I've been geeking out on this "Dog Listener" book, and by the recommendation of my soon-to-be dog trainer I ordered "Think Dog" by John Fisher. Based on what I've read on Fisher, his tactics of dealing with dogs are very similar to how Jan Fennell handles dogs, and just as similar to "The Horse Whisperer" that got all that good press for a while.
With these behaviorists, it all comes down to understanding that we are humans with human priorities, and dogs do not think like us (same with horses). Jan Fennell, John Fisher, and Cesar Milan get a bad wrap from a lot of people in forums, but all the belly-aching is tied to the fact that these forum enthusiasts (whose posts bear an un-nerving resemblance in prose to the typical ranting Gearslutz moron) believe that their dogs "understand" them. I don't believe that for a minute. We are vastly more intelligent creatures, and we need to take responsibility for the animal on it's own terms. My opinion, room for disagreement, I'm sure.
An example of dog psychology from the book (if you're an interested dog owner):
When a dog bolts out of the house without us our natural instincts as humans is to follow after him and say "Hey dog! WTF!? Get back here!" And some of us have humbled ourselves by chasing the animal. Inevitably he runs for a while, then looks back at you like its a game, you yell again and walk towards him, he continues to bolt in the same direction. The explanation in "dog language" is that dogs have instincts that dictate that there are two main domains: the den, or homebase, and then there is "the outside" which is relatively foreign but exciting and interesting as a potential hunting ground. The excitement a dog feels before going on a walk is supposed to be a direct expression of his instinctual excitement at the prospect of a hunt. If a dog feels that he is the alpha, then it is his job to lead the hunt. We thought they just wanted to take a walk! That's a human concept...dogs don't go for walks just for walks sake, they are satisfying an instinct and using their energy as nature intended. So the dog sees the open door as an opportunity to spend that energy and 'lead his pack' as the alpha in a hunt. We follow behind the escapee and start telling him "stop! stop!"...of course, he is a dog, and in his excitement all he hears is "woof! woof!" and sees a human in hot pursuit. In nature, this is how subordinate dogs follow their alpha and contribute to the hunt. In the dog's mind, we are playing our role as a subordinate hunter when we chase after him. Just because the dog knows the word "stay" doesn't mean that words are his primary method of communication, when you come at him at a run and he hears you vocalizing, that's a bark to him. He's too excited to think about the specific sound you are making. Then when we finally get to him we swat his bottom and play dominant by getting on top of him he's having a mini identity crisis. As if he were thinking: "What's wrong!? We were hunting together just fine and now I'm in trouble because I wasn't faster than you? I thought I was the leader?"
That example doesn't really cover the solution, only the problem and the dog psychology behind it. I think the main thing to take away is that it may be better off to think about controlling our dogs from the dogs POV. In Jan Fennell's book she basically demonstrates her belief that the key to owning a well behaved dog is to assert yourself as the alpha so that your subordinate checks in with you before doing much of anything at all. There are many who disagree, so I'm going to cross reference this info with the book by John Fisher to see what overlaps.
Either way, I'm taking this beastly set of jaws on stilts for a few more walks before I make any commitments. I need to be sure there is not a history of aggression on the pitt/Rhodesian side, and I need to know that he will except me and my girlfriend's 'alpha pair' status willingly. Not all dogs do so; thankfully most do (or so I've read).
HuePinnipedal Czar (: 3= Member
Since: Apr 11, 2004
Apr 13, 2011 03:55 pm Hope it all works out for the three of you. Dogs can really add alot to ones life. We get countless hours of entertainment from our meathead. Last night he was given a pig-ear as a treat, and spent two hours 'worrying' as to where to hide it. It was pretty dang funny, walking around the house, making 'worry-noises', and not letting his prized treat out of his sight, before he devoured it in just under ten minutes.lol
Quincysanhttp://www.unitedmusicians.infoContributor
Since: Nov 11, 2007
Apr 13, 2011 08:56 pm Dog was given to the owners brother. Dang! I'll take my time with these books and start cruising petfinder.
