recording (kick)

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Chris
Member Since: Aug 25, 2008

Im waiting on some over heads to come in to record my drums with a simple 3 mic recording (mixing to stereo before computer)... I thought i might mess around with the kick to see if i could get a decent sound.

My problem is when i plug my headphones into my mixer i cant get the bass drum loud enough to hear over myself hitting it; at least without it clipping.

So my question is how can i set up so that i can hear what will be recorded.. because right now i have to guess for eq then record samples..and then listen to the sample to hear what it will sound like!

also the samples i record are too quiet.. but any louder and they start clipping.. How can i fix this??

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MASSIVE Mastering, LLC
Member
Since: Aug 05, 2008

Mar 07, 2009 07:38 pm

You need a more powerful headphone amp and phones that can (A) handle more power and (B) isolate better.

Those aren't going to be good sounding headphones.

You aren't supposed to be listening "to the drums" in the cans - You're supposed to be listening to everything else.

Chris
Member
Since: Aug 25, 2008

Mar 07, 2009 08:01 pm

Im just listening to the drums to set eq* and i cant set eq because i cant hear the bass drum in my headphones over me actually hitting the bass drum

sorry about that*

Chris
Member
Since: Aug 25, 2008

Mar 07, 2009 08:11 pm

but thanks i hooked the headphone out on mixer to a guitar amp then plugged my headphones in the amp.. loose loads of quality but it definitely makes it loud enough!

I am not a crook's head
Member
Since: Mar 14, 2003

Mar 07, 2009 08:29 pm

What mixer and headphones are you using? And what software? It's easier to answer your questions if you fill out your gear bio in your profile.

Its surprising that you can't get your headphones ear-splittingly loud by cranking the headphone level and/or the master volume on your mixer.

If you're monitoring via your software (by using the "monitor" button on the kick track) then you could apply a compressor or even a limiter to the track to maximize its volume but keep it from clipping.

Chris
Member
Since: Aug 25, 2008

Mar 07, 2009 08:44 pm

thanks havnt ever really looked at my profile.. il add it in

but its a yamaha MG102c mixer and sonar 8

I can get it pretty loud but it clips before i can get it decently loud..
and i like the computer monitoring idea..
but i cant figure out why i can monitor through my speakers but when i plug my headphones into my speakers i dont get any sound but the sound from my computer(like music playing will come through but not what im recording... this is after i clicked echo)

Chris
Member
Since: Aug 25, 2008

Mar 07, 2009 09:09 pm

nvm i tried tapping on the mic and i can hear that so i guess again.. volume problem... iv got mixer volume as high as i can get it before the bar thing in sonar gets in the red.. but i still cant hear anything and whats being recorded is still really quiet.. any ideas??

Czar of Midi
Administrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002

Mar 07, 2009 09:30 pm

What are you using for an audio interface? I'll assume the built in sound card?

Not a good thing if your serious about getting a good sound, and that might be part of the too quiet recording problem as well.


Also just a little hint here. I don't put any EQ on when recording. Most record absolutely flat. There should be no need to boost any EQ while recording. If you EQ during recording that is it and it can't be fixed in the mix easily that way.

Czar of Midi
Administrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002

Mar 07, 2009 09:34 pm

Oh ya, I almost forgot.

If it is clipping and hitting the red in Sonar then it IS loud. And its your level settings on your sound card outputs that making it sound quiet. Not Sonar or the input coming into Sonar.

I am not a crook's head
Member
Since: Mar 14, 2003

Mar 07, 2009 10:46 pm

Something isn't right here judging by your last post. Your mixer volume shouldn't affect the levels in Sonar as far as your outputs are concerned. And the MG10/2 should have plenty of juice to power your headphones to deafening levels. My headphones are almost as loud as loudspeakers when I crank my MG mixer.

I use an MG10/2 plus a Delta 44 so we have pretty similar setups. Since your interface is a 2-in/2-out card, you can set up your routing like this:

Plug 1 mic into channel 1 of the mixer, and another into channel 2 of the mixer (assuming you use 2 mics). Then run a cable from the inserts of both of those channels to your interface's inputs. Only push the cables in to the first "click" and not all the way into the insert jack. This allows the insert jack to function as a direct out and won't route the signal to the mixer's main bus. This frees up the main bus to handle your interface's outputs. Run a cable from the interface's outputs to one of the stereo line inputs on your mixer. Then plug your monitors into the main outs of your mixer.

Then make sure your M-Audio control panel's routing tab sends either Monitor Mix or Windows Audio to hardware output 1/2. Set your software's device manager to use the Audiophile with M-Audio ASIO drivers. Then make sure you set your inputs and outputs in your software to use the Audiophile as well. I don't use Sonar so I'm not sure where these settings are or specifically what they're called. But hopefully my advice translates to Sonar well enough.

Good luck!

Czar of Turd Polish
Member
Since: Jun 20, 2006

Mar 07, 2009 10:49 pm

You can do what I do. Since I have everything in one room I use some in ear monitors along with hunting muffs to get and idea of where my drum mics sit. It's alot better than shooting in the dark but far from perfect.

The signal is probably hot enough as others have said, but if listening in the same room with non isolating phones you won't hear anything as the drum is too loud.

Chris
Member
Since: Aug 25, 2008

Mar 08, 2009 12:37 am

yea i thought about the muff idea might try it thanks!

and Tadpui the main mixer volume doesnt, just the channel level and gain affect the sonar levels... I was using rec out too*
also atm im using just my kick mic but i will be adding 2 O/H's when ever they get shipped.. so how would i go about your idea with 3 mics, since im pretty sure i only have the 2 channels with inserts?

and does anyone here have the maudio 2496? Iv re installed it many times, but after sonar is open for a bit and i decide to listen to some music in itunes, any song i play sounds like its being slowed down a fair bit.. any ideas on a fix? or is it maybe broken?

thanks!


I am not a crook's head
Member
Since: Mar 14, 2003

Mar 08, 2009 11:26 am

I you want to use channel 3 & 4 you can, although you won't be able to send your audiophile's outputs back to the mixer since you'll need to use the mixer's main bus for the mics. Just pan channels 3 and 4 hard left and hard right, respectively. Then turn their aux sends all the way up. Now the L aux output on the mixer will carry channel 3 and the R aux output will carry channel 4.

But with 2 mics, if you return the audiophile's outputs back to the mixer like I described above (I send them back to channel 7/8), you should then be able to use the level knob for channel 7/8 to crank the output volume way beyond what you can tolerate through your headphones.

Chris
Member
Since: Aug 25, 2008

Mar 08, 2009 02:35 pm

well i tried with just the kick mic which is what i needed to hear in the first place, and it worked perfectly! had to play with how far to push the one cable into the insert but its perfect! thanks!

does it matter if i record from the insert? or should i just use your idea for previewing?

Chris
Member
Since: Aug 25, 2008

Mar 08, 2009 03:04 pm

i think i found what my problem was too... My input is deffinatly loud enough (near 0db) but when i click play on what i record the bar is at like -50. I have no clue why... any ideas?? iv got my interfaces volume controls on full and the input is near 0db so its gota be a volume control somewhere, or maybe my interface is bad...???

I am not a crook's head
Member
Since: Mar 14, 2003

Mar 08, 2009 03:17 pm

Awesome! Glad to help.

It's fine to record from the insert jack. The signal should be the same quality and fidelity as what would come out of your mixer's outputs. Actually it might even be a slightly better quality signal since it has such a short path to travel inside the mixer.

As for your original problem, I don't know how to explain it. You're right that its got to be a volume or gain setting somewhere. I guess you'll have to fish around in either Sonar's device setup or possibly in the Sounds And Audio menu in Windows Control Panel.

Hopefully one of our resident Sonar users will come across your post soon and have some helpful advice for you.

Chris
Member
Since: Aug 25, 2008

Mar 08, 2009 06:31 pm

alright!, thanks again

Rockstar Vatican Assassin
Member
Since: Mar 20, 2009

Mar 23, 2009 09:43 am

Regarding the -50 output/recording. Does the mic require phantom power...and are you supplying enough of it to the mic?

Here's a trick I use to amplify headphones when they're not loud enough straight from the mixer. Use a pair of PC powered speakers on your mixer's headphone output, and plug the headphones into the speakers. That way, you now have two sets of volumes to work with: from the mixer and then from the self-powered speakers. Just make sure the powered speakers and your headphones can handle the output!!! Anything that can handle 10-20 watt RMS should do the trick!!!

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