Recording drums, ghetto style!
Home > Home Recording Forum > Recording Techniques > Recording drums, ghetto style!
Posted on Aug 20, 2005 01:48 pm
dkerwood
Member Since: Aug 20, 2005
Hey, all. I've been recording for a couple of years on a Compaq computer with stock soundcard (Win98), and Cakewalk Guitar Tracks 2.
I finally was able to find a good compressor directx plugin, as well as a limiter and noise gate, and I also just picked up a new tube mic preamp, so I'm ready to do some serious recording.
First of all, I have no idea how to record in stereo. I have a microphone input, and a line input. Obviously, I can only select one or the other to record from. I once tried plugging a stereo jack/adapter into the mic input, and only got sound from one channel, which tells me the mic input is probably mono. Does anyone know if the line input is mono or stereo?
Secondly, now I'm planning how to do everything, and I'm stuck on what to do with the drums. Typically I just take a microphone (in most of my home studio work, I just use a SM58) and put it in the room with the drums, and fix it later with EQ. Now that I've got the preamp, I can use either of my two condensors - MXL 990 and MXL 991 (it supplies the phantom power I need). But I'm still stuck on what to do with the drums.
I do have a mixer that I use live - an 8 channel old old OLD Peavey - but I've stopped trying to use it to record because it's rather noisy when introduced into the digital domain. That's why I've been running direct into my soundcard.
So my questions are two: First, does anyone know of a way that I can get a stereo input going on without buying a new sound card? Secondly, how do I best deal with drums with only one (or two) microphones?
[ Back to Top ]
olddogMember
Since: Jul 02, 2003
Aug 20, 2005 02:34 pm Odds are the line input is stereo. If your preamp has 2 inputs and 2 outputs then you can use that other wise you need a mixer with at least stereo outs and the appropiate adapter to use with the line in on the sound card.
The drum mic'ing I can't really help you with other than you'll probably need at least one mic on the kick and you could probably let the overhead capture the snare and the rest of the kit. You'd have to experiment with the placement. Or if your using a mixer put the 58 on the snare, 1 on the kick, and 1 overhead for the rest of the kit.
Dan
pjkPrince CZAR-mingMember
Since: Apr 08, 2004
Aug 21, 2005 10:37 am well, a mixer would help, to mix the signals together, then go into 1 stereo track. I'm not sure of what preamp you have, so i'm gonna guess, being tube, it's 1 channel. That means 1 mono track.
Having different type mic is a challenge too, as if you try the stereo pair recording, you're working with LDC and a SDC. The sounds will be different. And you wouldn't be able to track them together anyway if you've only a 1 channel preamp.
Also, a soundcard that can handle 4 inputs will give you worlds more control. Or 8, even more. This doesn't sound like the answer you were looking for, but to you may need to add to your equip list to be able to record like you want.
Just thinking out loud, sounds like a 6 or 8 channel mixer, and another mxl 990/991 combo kit, and a delta 44 (or equivelant) would be the ticket. Use the two LDC on each side of the kick (one side for kick/snare/hihat, other side for kick/toms), and the two SDC for the overheads.
Hope this helps some, sorry for the 'buy more gear' answer. But it will be tough getting a balanced stereo recording that sounds real with what you've listed. Not impossible, but tough.
Aug 21, 2005 02:12 pm Here's what I was thinking. Split out the stereo line input to two mono cords with the appropriate adapter. One channel would go to the tube preamp and then to a mic, the other would go straight to a mic.
I thought on the first run, I'd record the kick on one channel and snare on another. Then go back and record cymbals. I have access to an Audix drum mic set, so that shouldn't be too hard. I also may experiment with putting a mic on the kick and then using the LDC behind the kit and see how much of the snare I could still pick up.
One challenge I've run into with my software compressor - always before I would record drums just by using a single mic in the room and then I'd EQ some punch to the kick and some pop to the snare. Of course, now with the compressor, the drums cut through the mix more easily, but now everything is quite audible (undesired overtones that exist in the snare, but in the "real world" are minimized; light hi hat strokes). Ironically, using the compressor actually makes the snare fall out of the mix (which is why "real" recordings put the snare on a separate channel, I've now discovered).
What order would you guys suggest recording things in? When I'm doing one man band productions, I lay down a scratch track with guitar and vocals (with the click track in my ear), then record drums, bass, rhythm guitar, lead vocals, lead guitar, backup vocals (in that order). Sometimes it changes if I'm using a keyboard or other instruments. Usually around the time I record the lead vox I delete the scratch track.
But if I have a drummer now who has never recorded before, what would you guys suggest to put him both at ease and also in the groove? I know I'll need to have the typical scratch track with vox and guitar... should I include my bassist in the scratch track? Should I maybe even record the band as a whole, putting the drum mics on one channel and the rest of the band on the other channel? Then I could mute out the drum scratch track and let him record a good take...
Oh, one more question. What would you reccomend for a new soundcard? I'd probably be looking for the 8 channel variety. Do you know how big of a computer you need to process 8 simultaneous channels? I'll tell you, recording the band all at once would ease things A LOT. Then I could just go back through and tweak as necessary.
olddogMember
Since: Jul 02, 2003
Aug 21, 2005 02:36 pm I prefer to save the drums for last and I would consider having the bass in the mix essential, since the 2 tend to work off of each other.
Dan
Aug 21, 2005 02:46 pm The reason why I always record drums first when I'm recording alone is because I cue everything off of drum fills and cues. Also, my guitar rhythm is heavily influenced by whatever subtle groove the drummer is playing... of course, it may be the other way around, as well.
Also, since the bass and drums work off of each other, what do you have for the bass player to listen to when they record?
Aug 21, 2005 05:33 pm Erg. So I hooked it up rather as I mentioned before just to see if it would work. It's even more ghetto than I expected. Here's how:
My soundcard's line in -> 1/8"-1/4" stereo adapter -> stereo 1/4"- dual mono RCA adapter -> RCA cable (stolen from my DVD player) -> two RCA-1/4" adapters -> one to my Presonus TubePre preamp, which then has the LDC plugged into it via XLR cable, the other (here's where I got really creative) to a tuner I had handy, into which I plugged a dynamic mic (SM57 clone) via XLR-1/4" cable.
Don't worry, I'll get the proper cables and things tomorrow from Radio Shack.
Anyway, so now I tried to record. For some reason, my dynamic mic is super quiet. My recording software is set up with a 24dB meter, and the dynamic mic wasn't even showing up on the screen. I had to mute the condensor and crank up the recording levels to max to even see the dynamic mic on the meter, and even then it was peaking out at about -20dB. I was perplexed. Then it hit me. Duh. First of all, I'm running into the LINE IN jack, which means I'm getting none of the amplification that I normally get when plugging into the microphone jack... Secondly, I'm running the condensor through a preamp, for crying out loud, and a pretty hot one, at that. And the dynamic is going in naked. So of course it's not going to be as loud.
I guess I'll just have to hook up the mixer I've been fervently trying to avoid... anybody have any other ideas on how I can boost its gain without buying anything?
olddogMember
Since: Jul 02, 2003
Aug 21, 2005 05:56 pm Well when your recording track by track you just have to lay out tracking the instruments by their key role in the song. Some songs that might be the bass, others the drums, and yet others it would be the guitars.
What I usually do is make a quick drum track of just kick and snare (programmed), then lay down a scratch guitar track and proceed from there. After I'm pretty much done if neccessary I'll redo parts that could have a better groove when played with the other parts. That's one of the hardest parts of tracking individually is getting the groove flowing when you don't have a complete band playing because in a live situation everyone is playing off of everyone else, you just have work at it and redo parts as neccessary.
Dan
