OK, Mixer question (Behringer MX2442A)
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Posted on Apr 11, 2003 04:16 pm
Jason
Member Since: Feb 17, 2003
OK
Here is the problem:
I was going to record and i set my mixer up so that every "group" is assigned to its own bus. For example:
I assigned vocals to sub group one by panning the channel hard left and pressing the 1-2 sub button on that channel. that made the vocals channel be only on sub group one instead of one and two. then i send the four cables from the sub outs to my delta 44's 4 ins. when i go to record vocals, i only get meters in the left channel, but i can hear them through both speakers. i know it is where i have the vocals panned hard left, but the sub panning is center, which should bring both meters up right?
anyways, how can i fix it so that the vocals dont just record on the left side because even though i can hear the vocals in both speakers, when i record and play back, it is only in the left.
if anyone else has the behringer mx2442a and knows how to correctly do this, please help!!!! anyone help!!!!
thanks
jason
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MinkusMazBane of All ExistenceMember
Since: Mar 27, 2003
Apr 11, 2003 04:38 pm are you sure that you get stereo output from the way you've got the mixer hooked up? it sounds like your speakers are on mono for one reason or another, if you're putting it in panned left, and hear it hard left in your headphones. why not record just the left channel of the vocals instead of recorded stereo? then you can pan it any way you want.
JasonMember
Since: Feb 17, 2003
Apr 11, 2003 04:43 pm ok, here is a detailed setup of what i have. lets see if this helps explain it:
--mic in channel one panned hard left and assigned to sub group one
--sub group one panned center
--main monitor left out to left monitor, main monitor right out to right monitor
--sub outs 1-4 go into the insterts 1-4 on my m-audio delta 44
--outs on my delta 44 are as follows:
1 and 2 outs go to a stereo channel on board (17 & 18)
3 and 4 go into another stereo channel on the board (19 & 20)
i am using cool edit pro as multitrack software.
thanks
MinkusMazBane of All ExistenceMember
Since: Mar 27, 2003
Apr 11, 2003 04:52 pm --sub group one panned center
...is that a pan or a balance? it looks like your monitors see it as a pan, but your sound card as a balance.
JasonMember
Since: Feb 17, 2003
Apr 11, 2003 04:56 pm it is a pan. thats what it says on the mixer.
thanks
MinkusMazBane of All ExistenceMember
Since: Mar 27, 2003
Apr 11, 2003 05:03 pm if your sound card is hearing the vocals just in the left channel, then try just recording a mono track from the left channel instead of a stereo track. can you do that with cooledit pro?
JasonMember
Since: Feb 17, 2003
Apr 11, 2003 05:06 pm yeah, i can do that, then would i pan it so that it would be equal in both speakers?
thanks for your help
MinkusMazBane of All ExistenceMember
Since: Mar 27, 2003
Apr 11, 2003 05:07 pm yeah i imagine it would be automatically centered after recording a mono track. then you can pan as you please.
no problem. this place is really helpful.
JasonMember
Since: Feb 17, 2003
Apr 11, 2003 05:08 pm i will see what i can do. when i tried it before, it just played back in the left speaker. i will se if i can record a mono track and see if it plays back in both speakers.
thanks
Apr 11, 2003 05:18 pm Okay, let's just start over here-- The Delta's inputs are mono. So the output of your subgroup is also mono. So the signal going into the delta is one single signal with the vocals. Okay. So that rules out the possiblility of it having anything to do with your mixer. In the delta's monitor mixer window you can set the pan of an individual input to center, but that does not effect what is actually being recorded, only what you are monitoring. So this is your solution:
You should be recording your tracks in mono in Cool Edit Pro. Don't record in stereo... basically ever. If you are recording a stereo signal (two tracks at once) Then you might want to record stereo, but usually you should just record two mono tracks to keep them separate. Mono tracks are always panned center when you first record them. I just wanted to clarify things.
MinkusMazBane of All ExistenceMember
Since: Mar 27, 2003
Apr 11, 2003 05:28 pm same conclusion, better (and more informed) logic. thanks, PM.
JasonMember
Since: Feb 17, 2003
Apr 11, 2003 05:29 pm ok
yeah i figured it out finally. haha. i just had to set it so that cep would record mono. the default is stereo.
thanks for the help.
i have one more question though. on the deltas control panel, is it the lower the buffer size, the better the quality or what?
thanks
jason
JasonMember
Since: Feb 17, 2003
Apr 11, 2003 05:33 pm i was also wnating to know how to set the faders and monitor levels.
should i set the main out faders to 0db and leve it, then adjust the input volume by the faders on the subgroups?
Apr 11, 2003 05:37 pm Haha... No problem, MinkusMaz :-) You got the right answer in the end, I just wanted to clear up the rest of it because I had the same questions about the same thing a while ago.
Hmmm... Buffering... I think you'll have to ask someone else about that. I think the lower the buffer the more accuracy or something, but more chance of drop outs and system lock-up. Basically, the higher the safer.
Apr 11, 2003 07:13 pm About the faders and monitor levels:
I would say set your mixer's subgroup faders to 0db. Change the separate input volumes using the mixer's channel faders. Bring them up to 0db (If that doesn't clip the levels in CEP), and then add to it with your gain knob if necessary. Make sure you're recording as "loud" as you can without being in danger of clipping (An outboard compressor would help with this). The Delta 44 itself doesn't actually have recording input faders in/on it. The monitor mixer window is only for monitoring the output of the card, and does not affect the input recording volume at all. However, there are 3 levels of recording input in another area of the Delta control panel. Leave those all at -10 db. That's the most sensitive level; good for a home studio set up. As for the output (monitoring) levels, it doesn't really matter. You could pull up the outputs on the Delta Monitor mixer to 0db and just control things on your mixer, or you could do it the other way around. Whatever you want, just make sure you aren't putting too hot a signal back through the mixer that will cause distortion. (I don't think you'll really have to worry about that, though). Hope that helps.
JasonMember
Since: Feb 17, 2003
Apr 11, 2003 07:44 pm yeah that helps a lot. thanks
but again i have another question. when recording, should i record in 16-bit or 32-bit? the same with mixing and mastering?
thanks
juesContributor
Since: Dec 30, 2002
Apr 11, 2003 08:25 pm I personally record at 44.1Khz, 24bit - this gives you the additional headroom to play with along with avoid the nightmare of dithering the sample rate at final mixdown.
As for buffers - the lower the buffer, the less delay there is betwixt audio entering the soundcard and the same signal leaving it.
jues.
JasonMember
Since: Feb 17, 2003
Apr 11, 2003 08:39 pm in cep, the options that i have that i can find is either 16 or 32 bit. which should i do?
JasonMember
Since: Feb 17, 2003
Apr 11, 2003 08:48 pm i was reading somewhere that i should record at 32bit and mix down to 16bit. is this true?
JasonMember
Since: Feb 17, 2003
Apr 11, 2003 08:48 pm and when i mix down to 16bit, should i dither or not? what does that do anyways?
thanks
Apr 12, 2003 10:48 am To avoid all the dithering business (Quite a complicated mess..) I just record in 44.1khz and 16-bit all the time. It takes up a lot less space on your hard drive and keeps everything uniform. Most people can't percieve the difference in bit rates above 16-bit. Plus, you have to bring it down to 16-bit 44.1khz to put it on a CD anyway, so might as well start out that way.
Oh yeah.. now I remember about the buffer delay.
Jues-- What exactly do you mean by 24-bit offering more "headroom"? I don't really quite understand the difference between bit rates.
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Apr 12, 2003 05:57 pm Jason, you might try checking each cable one at a time into the input on the Delta you kow is live. Then try each sub out from the mixer to make sure they are all functioning. Then try each input on the delta to make sue they are all OK. It sounds as though you might have a bad connection somewhere along the way.
Oh yes, and if you want to record in stereo, you need to pan sub 1 hard left, sub 2 hard right, then sub 3 hard left and sub 4 hard right.
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Apr 12, 2003 08:15 pm As far as the buffer goes, set it as low as you can without an drop outs or distortion.
juesContributor
Since: Dec 30, 2002
Apr 12, 2003 08:54 pm Porp, this little picture helps me with Sample and Bit Rates:
The Sample rate is how many times a second (millisecond, whatever) the computer can "sample" (look at) the waveform and the Bit Rate is how much detail is can cram into each "sample"
although this is not 100% technically correct, it is a fairly decent representation and is easy to relate to.
As a result, recording at a higher bit rate will allow for a more detailed representation of the sound to be captured, it also give's plugins that process the audio more "headroom" to work, meaning that they don't slam into the brick wall limit of 16bit.
jues.
JasonMember
Since: Feb 17, 2003
Apr 12, 2003 10:37 pm in cep 2.0, i have the choice of dithering or not. i can select to mix down into 16bit, and put a check box beside of dithering if i want, or uncheck it if i dont want to dither. is that a good choice to deselect it?
thanks
juesContributor
Since: Dec 30, 2002
Apr 13, 2003 03:29 am No, not unless you are using an external dithering plugin such as Waves L1 / IDR.
jues.
Apr 16, 2003 01:59 pm Thanks Jues, that makes sense.
