Need some advice on Mixer/Preamp/Soundcard/Mics/etc.
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Posted on Sep 22, 2006 11:10 am
[ins]anarchist
Master of the Obvious?
Member Since: Jun 29, 2004
Right now, I've got an M-Audio Delta 1010, a terrible cheap hissy Nady 4-channel mixer, a borrowed SM-58, and a very decent computer. I know the 1010 doesn't have any preamps and that I'll need to preamp any mic signal I'd like to record, which means I'll need to buy an 8-channel preamp (correct?) in order to record much of anything through the 1010. I've been using the crappy Nady mixer's preamps into the 1010, which gives me 2 channels, but obviously I'd like to be able to utilize the card to its fullest! So my basic questions are as follows:
1 - Should I keep the 1010 & buy an 8-channel pre, a nice 8-channel mixer, and some sort of drum mic kit? or...
2 - Should I sell the 1010 & buy a similar solution with a built-in pre, a nice 8-channel mixer, and some sort of drum mic kit? or...
3 - Should I buy a nice 8-channel, 8-bus mixer with useable pre's and a nice drum mic kit?
Or something else? I'm not poor, but I don't have more than $300-450 to throw around on gear unless there would be huge benefits to saving up $800+ for some really nice gear. I'm in a band that is currently writing material for a full-length and we need something to get the ideas down and possibly use the material as promo material for the record.
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pjkPrince CZAR-mingMember
Since: Apr 08, 2004
Sep 22, 2006 11:23 am I like option 3, mixer, and drum mic kit. I've used a yamaha mg16/4 for my 1010lt, and now for my ESP1010.
The preamps are very clear, and accurate. I've had no problem with them. It only has 4 bus output, but I use the channel inserts as signal taps, connecting each to an input on my esp1010. Then 1 output pr back into the mixer (stereo channel) for monitoring, and it's all swell.
I doubt you'd fetch a ton for the 1010 used, so it's probably worth more to you than the $$$ it'd create. Plus it's still very good, so you probably won't increase on it's quality.
I'd question though, the mixer = 280$us, which leaves around 100-200$ for a drum mic kit. That's not giving you much to work with, nor many options to choose from.
Maybe rice-a-roni for the band for a few weeks =).
I'd also add, that very nice recordings of a drum kit can be made with 2 or 3 mics. You have to work at it, but it can be done. Maybe a pair of samson SDC (110$us) and a LDC (SPB1 < 100$us). Noize used the samson C02 and liked them much for what they are. I've used my SPB3 (studio project B3, brother to the B1) on kick drum / kit sound and it worked very well.
my .02$us
hth
Sep 22, 2006 11:43 am Thanks for the advice/reply! :)
So channel inserts come after the preamps? If so, that sounds like pretty much exactly what I'm looking for! I was under the assumtion that the inserts were pre-preamp, but I guess when I think about it that wouldn't really make much sense anyway.
When it comes to drum mics, does the fact that we're a metal band make any difference? Big tom/snare sounds are a must, so I figure the least we could probably get away with a snare mic, a bass drum mic, 2 or 3 tom mics, and two overheads, assuming we wanted a real tight sound. I'm really out of the loop when it comes to specific mics to use :/
pjkPrince CZAR-mingMember
Since: Apr 08, 2004
Sep 22, 2006 11:55 am Yep, post-preamp, but pre-fader. I've been doing it this way for awhile. You also get to use the mixer as a monitor-mixer, as signal exiting the mixer now is your incoming new signal(s), plus the pre-recorded tracks (via stereo inputs).
I guess metal may have some more aggressive requirements for mic'ing. I've not done much of that, so I'm probably not the best person to ask.
Sounds like you're on the right track, though it may (will) be spendy to outfit a kit with decent mics.
(ain't that always the way).
SM57 are a solid go-to for snare and tom mics. Not sure about Kick. The C02 would work for OH. I've gotten a pair of Rode NT5 for my OH, and acoustic recording. Haven't used them much yet though.
Sep 23, 2006 05:14 am Most drummers I work with use drum mike kits and they are very good value,just ask/research which one to go for.
Oct 02, 2006 11:24 am Update:
I got a used Behringer UB2442FX mixer (zzsounds link: www.zzounds.com...m--BEHUB2442FXP ) for a good deal ($170), so I'm one step closer to utilizing the full potential of my 1010! Now on to mics...
pjkPrince CZAR-mingMember
Since: Apr 08, 2004
Oct 02, 2006 12:07 pm cool. that mixer has direct outs on mono channels, so you won't have to use the channel inserts. just plug from direct out over to your input. This leaves the channel insert open for external hardware, like EQ, compressor, etc.
Snake_BiteWannabe Producer/Tech StudentMember
Since: Aug 11, 2005
Oct 17, 2006 07:46 am thats my set up - direct outs of ub2442fx and into 8 inputs on 1010lt (may upgrade to the 1010 tho). works well as its nice and tidy i.e. dont have to have half channels on sub groups and the oter half somewhere else etc, every channel strip does the same thing.
for drum mics, i prefer the custom method i.e. buy each mic individually and create ur own micing kit - alot more expensive, but i prefer it because a)the mics arnt then restricted to drum clips, so can be used on normal stands and used for other purposes e.g. industry standard sm57, use on snare and then take it off and go use it infront of a guitar amp, where as if youve got a clip-on snare mic, that would work well for guitar amp, you cant use it unless you find some ingenius way of getting it in front of the guitar amp and B) you can easily sell a mic and upgrade to a better one, where as with a mic kit, much harder to sell the individual mics from a kit, so ur stuck with them if you dont like them. i personally use samson c02's for overheads (great for the price), shure sm57 for snare (so predictable) shure pg52 for kick drum (not the best, but does the job for me) and 3 behringer ultravoice xm8500's for the toms (just cheap mics as i couldnt afford 3 decent dynamic mics, will do something about em one day.
however, if your looking just for drum recording, at low price, and not too worried about top-notch quality, just respectable, get something like the samson 7kit - no where near the best on the market, but my drummer has used them on our bands demo recordings and they aint too shabby, much better than i was expecting.
