Americans, Boycott Pepsi?
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Posted on Sep 16, 2002 02:00 pm
dbmasters
Administrator Since: Apr 03, 2002
Rumor has it that Pepsi is going to put out a new can featuring the Peldge of Allegiance, reportedly skipping the "Under God" part, supposedly to not offend anyone. Well, that offends me, how about you?
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el musicoFreeleance Producer/Engineer/GtrMember
Since: Aug 11, 2002
Sep 16, 2002 02:48 pm if our pledge of allegiance is to be reproduced for marketing purposes, it should definately be in it's uneditted form. as prior air force, i actually find it insulting for a company to use something that, to me, symbolizes what men and women have died for just to gain market share. it's quite disgusting actually.
Sep 16, 2002 04:00 pm El musico, thanks for the insight, I never really looked at it that way, not only editing the pledge, but using it for marketing purposes. You are right, that is disgusting, I never thought about it like that.
LokiCone PokerMember
Since: Apr 07, 2002
Sep 16, 2002 06:10 pm It's all crap. It's like when they took the ten commandments out of the courtroom. I'm sorry, but if our Pledge of Allegience offends you, Leave the country, that's all there is to it.
zekthedeadcowEat Spam before it eats YOU!!!Member
Since: May 11, 2002
Sep 16, 2002 07:28 pm I thought that happened earlier this year. . .hmm. . .
anyway I find it more disgusting that it is used for marketing purposes. . .but I don't drink pepsi as I think the pop itself is disgusting :)
and actually the pledge was origionally without the "Under God" and I think it was added by executive order by Ike...I think thats who did it...
Any way it's commonly said wrong anyway
It's:
"One nation under God"
meaning - One nation by Gods direction
It's Not:
"One Nation,
Under God"
meaning - It's one nation and the nation is under Gods direction
There is a significant theological difference in the addition of the comma :)
Sep 16, 2002 07:41 pm good points, zek, and yes the "under God" was added later, but, most of us here I believe were raised as that version being the only one we ever learned, which makes it, though not technically, the "official" version to us, being the only version we ever said.
And really, regardless of comma or no comma, taking it out removes God.
That said though, you do bring up some very good points.
MitchMember
Since: Apr 14, 2002
Sep 16, 2002 07:42 pm Dang, I didn`t know that. I hate it when people cant just leave things well enough alone. Who cares if God is in the pledge. If you don`t like it, then don`t say it. But it makes me proud to say it and I don`t care if the whole nation stops, I`ll always say it. EVEN IF THEY MAKE IT FREAKIN ILLEGAL! I`ll GO TO JAIL SAYING IT!
Amen, Loki. Just leave the country.
God bless America!
Sep 16, 2002 09:40 pm and how about that new holiday bush created? i think thats a great idea.
but you know whats going to happen.. patriots day is going to turn into memorial day, and labor day etc.
and marketing will get the idea of attaching a sale to it every year as another way to sell american beliefs and the hard working american people right down the river for a couple of bucks.
i hate marketing. i hate sales. they are the most corrupt, soulless people next to lawyers and televangelists (namely falwell & graham).
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Sep 16, 2002 10:06 pm I did some research tonight on the PepsiCo thing. If I am not mistaken, the board voted no to the pledge on the can. It would be corperate suicide at this time for them to even think about such a moronic thing. They have allready in just a few day's since the rumor began lost sale's. And I am talking some major sale's here. There is also a rumor that, if indeed PepsiCo did launch this can to market, CocaCola will imediatly begin working to take the American stand against such blasfemus behaviour.
I am a die hard coke drinker anyway, since PepsiCo is owned by, shall we say a company that support's, THE DARK SIDE.
Sep 16, 2002 10:10 pm Personally I hate lumping people like that, not all marketing and sales are evil, just like not all lawyers and televangilists are bad. However, most stereotypes exist because there is some root in the truth.
That said, I still hate lumping people into categories without actually knowing them, no matter how hard it is at times.
MitchMember
Since: Apr 14, 2002
Sep 17, 2002 01:24 am Just outta curiosity, who owns Pepsi?
Sep 17, 2002 06:09 am well... this is how i see it.
i am canadian, my whole life growing up here in the states i have been ridiculed for who i am. i do not believe in the christian god, i believe in buddhism (aka, not-god), which means the country i live in (and where i am allowed to PRACTICE my own religion) is under the care/guidence/ruling of GOD. Growing up in school from day one i waved my right to say the pledge. and at the beginning of every year the teacher would give me crap. sorry guys, but not everyone in the world sees things the way that you do. in that it is better to please NON than offend ONE. think about that for a moment................ now read on.
well, even though i think their pop is quite nasty as well.. i stick up for pepsi. they are actually being quite honest about how they want to earn their money in this country by their blatent marketing skills. while everyone in the stock world skims their millions, pepsi just wants everyone in this country with their new-founds patriotism to know they are behind them 100(non-religious)%.
Just because they wernt planning to say "GOD" does not make them evil by any means. in fact, i believe if anyone is closer to evil it is bible followers. in my religion there is evil, but it is ignored. in yours you dwell on it (as you are now). just remember, you use numbers, the "GOD" of our numeric system was priased as 3000 people died on american soil a year ago. thinking...thinking.... right. Maybe Pepsi saw it from that aspect. there is good/bad where ever you look. so just keep your eyes closed and live your life looking out for number one.
(before you delete my post, i just want to say the reason you are ALL HERE IN THIS COUNTRY is Franklin D Rosevelt, greatest american president in history and in future, an atheist. Just because someone doesent say god, doesnt mean they are wrong, obviously he wasnt.)
Sep 17, 2002 07:05 am I have no intension of deleting your post, you said nothing wrong, and you have valid points. For one, I am disgusted that you were riducled as a kid for being Canadian, that is simply wrong and ignorant. Nor do I feel that anyone should have their religion controlled (providing of course that religion does not wish or promote harm on any other person or people) I believe strongly in freedom of religion.
I feel your crack about people that follow the Bible as being evil is justified in the stereotypical sense, as much of the most outspoken "religious leaders" are, in fact, the most judgemental, hate-mongering people I have personally ever witnessed. I am a Christian, and at the same time I am embarrassed to be lumped in with these "Christians". I am not a Bible-banging, fire and brimstone type of person, I personally believe int he spirit of the Bible, the parts that most organized religions seems to have forgotten. The parts about forgiveness and tolerance, helping your fellow man and not judging. Most of the most outspoken of this so-called "Christian" group are the people that preach hating alternative lifestyles and different opinions, personally I find the differences in people and opinions intriging and interesting and it is what makes this world exciting at times. Like yours, I respect opinions that are not hateful or harmful.
That said, as a true Christian, I am against taking "under God" out of the Pledge, not because of moral or religious reasons, but where does a softdrink company get off on changing a national statement of allegiance?
That and, well, I agree, Pepsi products suck anyway.
And I am not "dwelling" on anything, I was just very curious to see what people thought, and I am finding out :-)
MitchMember
Since: Apr 14, 2002
Sep 17, 2002 01:18 pm ACleroc,
Just want to let you know that true Christians are not hate-mongering, judgemental idiots. THe very message of the Bible is love and forgiveness. Those who call themselves Christians and do not follow this need to reassess their claim as a Christian.
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Sep 17, 2002 10:02 pm Very well said, from both side's. ACleroc, you are welcome here anytime. As dB stated, you made your belief known, and did not offend anyone. I do agree with dB on the fact that it is the way someone state's their message that effect's the way we see them and their group. There are those who would have us belive the world should see thing's as they do, and that is not how it work's. We all believe in something a little differant. I do believe there is someone, or something that over see's our destiny. That is why we are allowed to make mistake's, and eventually for the most part, correct them. It is those who do not see they have made a mistake, and think that their way is the only way, that give someone else's religion a bad name.
Enough said, now welcome to the community. And feel free to stop here anytime.
Noize 2 U
Sep 18, 2002 01:22 pm Mitch,
why are the 10 commandments all based on negative thoughts? it could be said "thou shall let live", right? "thou shall stay true to thy partner" and so on and so forth. why do thousands of people give millions of dollars to those "priests" on tv? better yet, why are churches even asking for money? in their extravegant 10 million dollar churches? big tall blah blah blah.
heres a perfect example:
2 weeks ago i moved into a new neighborhood. down the street there is this church. its big, its flauncy, and its FOR SALE!?!?! how can you sell the house of god? where i come from beliefs cant be bought. having said that here is the real deal-
THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A TRUE CHRISTIAN. try as hard as you want, but no one lives by every law. maybe you should reasses your statement instead of asessing your opinion of the majority.
Sep 18, 2002 01:40 pm True, no one does live by every law, but many try.
"All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God" is a Bible verse that comes to mind. It's not being perfect, it's living as good as you can and honestly feeling bad when you do sin (in your heart, not "confessing to a priest" and saying the words and going through the motions for forgiveness)
As far as the extravagant churches and such, that uphauls me as well, I find that to be a disgusting waste of money that could be better spent serving the community or the world at large. Which is why I don't support churches like that.
"Where 2 or 3 are gathered together in my name, there am I" is another verse that comes to mind, which to me does make the religions building these huge cathedrals total hypocrites as they could worship in a members basement (which some do) and it is just as meaningful as in some big elaborate church.
Don't forget, there are also plenty of small churches that do try to do good with the money they get. And in the big picture, churches do need money to operate, just like anything else, so money is necessary, it's a matter of how it is used that makes the difference. As par for the course you, like anyone else, are judging the whole lot by the worst in the lot.
it seems to me that you are just as guilty of lumping all "Christians" together as you say we are of lumping together all people who are not. Which by the way, I don't, I personally have no issues with people that are not Christians, everyone has their own beliefs, and that's cool with me. And for the record, I totally see you point about the Pledge and how it is pushing our beliefs on the non-believing nation.
"Let he who is without sin cast the first stone" rings a bell as well, these examples are what I was talking about when I was speaking of the Bible that many religions convieniently forget about. We really need not insult and ridicule each other. I find it much more enjoyable accepting differences and living with them. If we all thought and felt the same this world would be very dull. And I do believe this until somebody's "differences" starts hurting another person, at that point it's not a difference, it's wrong.
Actually these two very thought-provoking threads have really made me re-think my stance on the couple subjects.
MitchMember
Since: Apr 14, 2002
Sep 18, 2002 09:33 pm I don`t see a difference whether it says "thou shalt not kill" or "thou shalt let live." ITs all the same.
And there are such things as true Christians, I see them every day. I live with them, I work with them, I go to school with them, I go to church with them. And I ty hard to be one myself. While some believe it is possible to live above sin WITH and only with the help of God, God always offers forgiveness to those who ask.
As far as the big churches asking for money, I don`t necessarily agree with that. In some cases, thats just plain wrong.
What is your take on Jesus Christ? No matter what your take on Him spiritually is, you cant deny his existence on Earth.
Sep 18, 2002 11:03 pm db.. ive often wondered the same thing about the churches.
i personally do not believe in anything. but i know waste when i see it.
one does not need to attend church or build giant builings 'in his name' in order to find god [or whatever name you call him]. one doesnt even need the bible or any other religious book for that matter. they are all tools used to inspire and help guide those who need it, when they need it.
church going has turned into more than a social/community gathering than a religious activity [at least in memphis]. sure, there is some religion generally involved..
a lot of companies and institutions do things with their money that can be viewed as wasteful. charitites and other community services would be a much better area for them to spend this excess cash lining their pockets.
MitchMember
Since: Apr 14, 2002
Sep 18, 2002 11:24 pm Collapse, thats true about some churches. But there are other churches that give until there is no more to give. My church, for one, can`t afford to build a new church because they give so much away. And you know what? They love it. They don`t sit on their butts and complain. They are happy because they know that they are doing exactly as Jesus instructed them to do.
So I just want you to know that not every church is self-centered....
Toodles
Sep 19, 2002 12:09 am good for them. i can respect that a hell of a lot more than the ones that choose to hoard the money for "religious purposes".
as i said, i was only speaking of churches ive seen here in memphis, but im fairly confident that every city has a few like this. we just happen to have a lot of them.
to give you an idea of the sort of things im referring to. there is one church in particular with a reputation. bellvue baptist church. they have a huge church [granted they have a fair sized congregation] with their own bowling alleys and sports complex. on new years of 2000 they lit the sky up with 3 massive concrete crosses that can be seen from miles away. and they had their own off ramp built off the near by interstate.
a lot of us non-church goers see this excess and have come to refer to the place as "six flags over jesus". the place makes me sick heh.
weve got a couple others that come close to that as well. guess that is what happens when you live in the bible belt.
MitchMember
Since: Apr 14, 2002
Sep 19, 2002 01:01 am Man, that is pretty bad. I`d have to say that that is disgusting. Its people like that who, in my personal opinion, arent too worried about what thier Maker thinks of them. Theres a whole lot more to Christianity than just showing up for church. I think alot of people are just trying to get by by their chinny-chin chin.
Goodnight all
Sep 19, 2002 05:12 am I think the main issue we are discussing here are two (or three) very different things. I have spent many years of my life studying religion. Not just Christianity, but religions of all types, and I have come to Christianity because it makes the most sense to me of anything I studied, included atheism and paganism.
The single biggest problem is that two many people believe in "church" or believe in "religion". That's crap, though admirable as it may/can be, it's man made garbage. What you need to do is belive in "God".
Churches such as collapse has mentioned (we have all seen places like that I am sure) are sad, sickening actually, but judging the entire group people referring to themselves as "Christians" based on those is not unlike judging all mid-eastern people because of the Al-Quida Terror Network or Saddam and his regime. Or judging all black people becasue of OJ Simpson.
I have said it before, and I will say it again, if one experiences, I mean truly experiences "God" not "religion" I have yet to find a better feeling inside.
Other than when a new sound card comes in the mail or something ;-)
There are so many people out there that claim they are Christians, yet only know what their pastor has told them, it kills me. Know the Bible, not just the parts you feel you need...the whole thing. It's really a beautiful story as a whole.
zekthedeadcowEat Spam before it eats YOU!!!Member
Since: May 11, 2002
Sep 19, 2002 09:23 am "2 weeks ago i moved into a new neighborhood.
down the street there is this church. its big, its flauncy, and its FOR SALE!?!?! how can you sell the house of god? where i come from beliefs cant be bought. "
Well, where I come from we don't "believe" in buildings. Church's arn't the only religious buildings bought and sold it simply that there are so many more unorganized ministries that don't do a proper "church plant" that you are more likely to see a church than a temple or mosque.
. . .and The House of God - maybe you should learn the religion. God laughed at David when david told God he would build him a house on earth "Heaven is my throne and the Earth is my footstool" he replied. In the New Testiment the Temple of God is the body.
I belong to a "newer" (5 years old) episcopal church plant. Our estimate for our building is $15 million. . .but that includes a school. However building in this area is horribly expensive and we got an 11 acre property. We are shareing a drive way with a Jewish Temple and the odd thing is that that temple is probably going to go bankrupt because of thier unique ability (definately defeats any jewish=money steriotype) to mismanage money. If they go defunkt before we break ground we would seriously consider buying their building.
also it only costs $50 to become a minister of any religion :)
Sep 20, 2002 10:24 am zek... you totaly missed the point.and you contradict yourself. what im saying is if you wantto believe you dont have to go to church and spend money to believe in god. i spend no money on my religion. your spending 15 million dollars on a church. why not send 15 million dollars to starving kids in africa. i hope i run into you someday pal. thats all i have to say.
Sep 20, 2002 02:09 pm Religion is what you make of it. Some it works for, some it doesn't...that doesn't make anybody right or anybody wrong, it just makes people different.
I have heard the "relationship" comment before, and depending on your point of view, it can make sense and easily be viewed as that.
MitchMember
Since: Apr 14, 2002
Sep 20, 2002 03:04 pm I don`t know if I agree with that particular statement. I think religion works for everybody. Especially my religion. (Christianity) : )
Sep 20, 2002 03:10 pm As nice as that would be to believe, I can't, nothing works for everybody...it's that whole "free will" thing we were blessed with.
MitchMember
Since: Apr 14, 2002
Sep 20, 2002 09:15 pm I find that interesting. Lemme ask ya something. Please don`t take this wrong. You said you were a Christian, and I don`t doubt that, but why would God send Jesus to earth to die for us and make it possible to have eternal life through Him if its not for everybody? Are you saying that its for a select few and that Jesus didn`t die for everyone?
Just curious.
Sep 20, 2002 10:32 pm I am not talking about Christ's availablity, I am talking about people's availability.
MitchMember
Since: Apr 14, 2002
Sep 21, 2002 12:24 am I see. I was just wondering. In other words, Christ is available to anyone, but there are some who just won`t accept it. I agree with that...
Goodnight all
