Acoustic guitars, Laptop computers, and maybe Soundcards. Help!
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Posted on Nov 19, 2004 02:24 am
andrewandrew
Member Since: Nov 19, 2004
Hey, I have a question regarding acoustic guitars, laptop computers, and soundcards. Right now I am trying to record with this set-up: my 70's Ovation, mic'd with an sm57 at the soundhole, running into a Behringer ub2222fx-pro. I run this into the *mic input* of my Toshiba Satellite A45 (i read on homerecording.com that it is nearly unacceptable to run any recordings into the mic in, but i have no choice because it doesn't have a regular line-in). I use Cakewalk 9.
I have, so far, not been able to reproduce an acceptable acoustic guitar sound. I have been trying to fool around with the EQ settings, but I know there has to be a better way than this! Would getting a good external soundcard be a worthy investment? It would take a lot of saving. I am only planning to record at most 2 or 3 instruments at a time.
Please help!
Andrew
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Nov 19, 2004 06:20 am Welcome to HRC :-)
I see two red flags here personally. recording.com is correct, running a line level signal, like that from a mixer, is not supposed to go into a mic level input, that is 50% of the reason you are getting a bad sound, the other 50% is using a substandard sound card. Also, an SM57, while being a very cool mic for a lot of things, isn't really well suited for an acoustic guitar, you would be better off with some type of condensor.
A higher quality sound card would help emensly. There are a few to choose from at www.homerecordingconnecti...t&cat_id=22
which should get you in the right direction. SOund cards shipped with laptops, and 99% of desktops are not made for recording studio use and really don't do it very well. They are meant to play games and playback CD's and DVD's.
Nov 19, 2004 03:11 pm Thank you and thank you for the welcome. I've been fussing so much with the eq levels on my mixer and knowing that it wasn't the right way. Is there any certain sound card that would be a particular value if I am planning on recording mainly acoustic guitar and vocals?
Appreciatively,
Andrew
zekthedeadcowEat Spam before it eats YOU!!!Member
Since: May 11, 2002
Nov 19, 2004 09:55 pm plus one other detail... the sound hole is not where you're supposed to mic acoustic guitars :)
You should mic the box...I usually have two places:
For bassy sound the corner of the box just below the elbow of the strumming arm...and then for less bassy (but sometimes too thin) the corner underneith where the neck attaches. when possible I try to mic both with two Rode NT1s...and sometimes an additional SM57 for further down the neck... plus each mic is fairly close to the guitar for me usually within 2-3 inches so you have to stand still :)... some guitarists I've worked with can't stand standing still through an entire song though...:)
TadpuiI am not a crook's headMember
Since: Mar 14, 2003
Nov 20, 2004 01:06 am I'd think that micing an acoustic that close with condensors would, due to the proximity effect, give an overly bassy or boomy sound. Of course, I've never tried it so who knows. But you are using NT1 which have that hi-freq presence that maybe balances it out.
But yeah, micing the soundhole will give you mostly pick noise and bass, not exactly the most desireable acoustic sound :)
I've always heard to mic at the 12th - 15th fret at 12" or 18" in front of the neck (I do it at about 8" because I use a dynamic mic).
I've also heard of micing over the guitarist's shoulder to capture it how the player hears it. I've also heard of using the X-Y config, but I have no freaking clue what that is, even tho its been explained to me a few times.
Nov 20, 2004 03:32 am Curious about the condenser mics. What is it that specifically sets condenser mics apart from dynamic mics? Also, on an unrelated note, it seems that most shows I have been to involved an acoustic guitar being mic'd at the soundhole. Maybe this was a wrong observation, but if so, why is this done?
cheers,
andrew
zekthedeadcowEat Spam before it eats YOU!!!Member
Since: May 11, 2002
Nov 20, 2004 05:21 pm It's done because a lot of people don't know what they're doing. :) Plus many times the mics are put there for show/backup to wireless acoustic pickups... like the ribbon mics on the desks of late night talkshows
they think... sound hole... hmm... must be where the sound comes from...
but it's exactly the same concerpt as the sound hole in a drum... which you don't want to mic either :)
From the glossery:
condenser - A Condensor mic often used in studio applications is a more sensitive mic than it's counterpart the dynamic. Available in a variety of pick-up patterns. Per increased sensitivity needs power to operate refered to as Phantom power.
dynamic mic - A Dynamic mic often used "on stage" offers durability. Although less sensitive than the condensor does not require power to operate. Dynamics are also limited to cardiod pick-up pattern.
oh...and "normally" it _would_ give an overly bassy sound but unless you paid a couple grand for the acoustic it's probably going to need it. :) Each guitar is different too... so I do check if the guitar is bassy or thin... they're usually thin... ...mine's more bassy but was "best of the 20 on the rack" at elderlys in Lansing, MI.
Nov 20, 2004 10:42 pm Zek,
thanks for the response. That's sort of what i figured regarding the house technicians. I guess all that is left to do now is research the best condenser mic/laptop sound card in my price range and hope to find a good price on ebay. Any other ideas/pitfalls-i-should-look-out-for?
Thanks again everyone,
Andrew
zekthedeadcowEat Spam before it eats YOU!!!Member
Since: May 11, 2002
Nov 21, 2004 02:31 pm The problem with audio equipment is that you really have to look out for everything... Read the specs and know what they mean and how they affect the equipments performance.... and then if certain specs are missing you know what the company doesn't want you to see :)
ie: a brand new mic might be listed on musicians friend as "Pro Broadcast quality" with a frequency response of 1hz to 60khz... but has no listing for the signal to noise ratio... the spec thats not listed is always really bad... companies never run out of room to advertise the positive qualities of their product. :)
Also words that _degrade_ the quality you should expect are :)
Pro (especially embedded in the name of the product)
Broadcast
Studio Quality
CD quality
Sounds like a Neuman
Flat response
This website has a lot of great articles on everything:
www.theprojectstudiohandbook.com/directory.htm
Nov 22, 2004 01:01 am Zek,
thank you (and everyone else) for all the help and advice. I'll check out that link to continue learning.
thanks a lot!
andrew
