Who does recording OUTSIDE of their studio?
Home > Home Recording Forum > Sampling & Field Recording > Who does recording OUTSIDE of their studio?
Posted on Sep 07, 2004 01:45 pm
flame
...bringing sexy back
Member Since: Jul 01, 2002
thats kinda what this new forum is all about, so id be interesting to know who records stuff whilst on the move...
ive got a four track for doing this, a dictaphone, a minidisc and a laptop for doing mobile stuff, which ranges from recording piano parts, vocals, and recently an orchestral part, down to the little stuff like recording cars driving by, bottles opening, etc etc etc
what do you guys do 'outside the box'?
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vdalehubbardLost for words with all to say.Contributor
Since: Sep 12, 2003
Sep 07, 2004 01:53 pm That's all I do, all the instruments in my band (church) are about 5 miles from my house/bedroom/studio.
My PC is custom and isn't too bad to move around, I just have a flat screen to move with it. The Delta 1010 isn't too big. I do carry my studio monitors with subwoofer, just wrap them in towels and place them carefully on my backseat. Wish I had some custom cases for them. Then, my Soundcraft board isn't too heavey. I wish all this was in racks which will guess happen soon. I just move it all and hook up, takes about 2 hours and that includes micing all the drum mics. Plus, I have my buddy help. Then, I have about 2 days free to record and bring it all back home. Isn't too bad, get used to it.
flame...bringing sexy backMember
Since: Jul 01, 2002
Sep 07, 2004 01:57 pm cool!
Sep 07, 2004 02:33 pm Well, I've no done it yet but as I mentioned in another thread, Im gonna record a live performance when I get doon to do some gigs.
I'll just be using a mini-disc recorder so I am hoping for a decent engineer!!
It'll be different I guess. I'll have NAE CONTROL over the mix and whatever goes doon, I'll need to live with I guess.
Presumably the engineer will be doing the out front sound so there is nae clipping?? Dunno, Ive never done engineering at a gig maself so I dunno.
Should be interesting tho...I'll sure as hell give it a bass. Hopefully I'll be able to master it all when I get it back using Forge and see how it sounds...
Coco.
P.S. Good idea for a forum Flame...nice work!
Sep 07, 2004 03:58 pm i'd like to get into recording ambient environments.
flame...bringing sexy backMember
Since: Jul 01, 2002
Sep 07, 2004 05:22 pm what portable gear ya got forty?
Sep 07, 2004 05:53 pm nothing, flame. i've seen a few articles on that ambisonic technique, which is what i'd like to do. i want to record the northern pennsylvania woods, where i go camping sometimes, and next time i'm up there in march i want to record these forlorn little frog chorales--these things start singing on mid march nights when it's still very cool outside and the trees are bare, and its just so strange. also, i wanna grab a few thunderstorms and maybe a creek. but i need to read up and see if i'll be able to afford what i need sometime down the line. i remember hearing about the 'using headphones as stereo microphones' technique, but then that one pro recording dude on here posted something about true ambisonic techniques, which i thought seemed like it required a bunch of gear, and right then the dream died. lol.
flame...bringing sexy backMember
Since: Jul 01, 2002
Sep 07, 2004 06:02 pm i read about that ambisonic thing today, lemmee go find the site.
Sep 07, 2004 08:34 pm wow, so it is possible. i'll make a set in the near future and just use a handheld recorder. thanks flame!!! the binaural stuff sounds wicked-cool.
DiemusikString benderMember
Since: Unknown
Sep 07, 2004 10:56 pm Hey great job guys! I think you were reading my mind! I have had my eye on a mini-disc recorder for a little while just for this. Plus a do a lot of recording in the field anyhow because I am working on a couple of indie movies right now. Cool new section!
flame...bringing sexy backMember
Since: Jul 01, 2002
Sep 08, 2004 04:49 am we're getting some good feedback on this forum so far...bring it on!
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Sep 08, 2004 08:32 pm Diemusik, I use an MD for sampling all the time. A good mic is a plus but not an absolute necesity. If you can pop for the extra get the one that will export digital as well, but they are not cheap and I do admit I get good results just shooting the audio out analog into my PC.
I love the portability of it and the audio is very good.
Flame, nice site you listed. I gotta go check it out better when I get more time.
DiemusikString benderMember
Since: Unknown
Sep 08, 2004 11:04 pm Noise I wish I had read your post before I went out tonight. I bought a Sony MZ-S1 Net MD tonight for $50.00 at a second hand type store. It has digital in but not out. Thanks for the advice though! I cant believe these things never really hit it big. This is a cool little tool.
DiemusikString benderMember
Since: Unknown
Sep 08, 2004 11:10 pm Oh yeah guys. I dont know if you know it or not but the Fostex MR8 has the ability to be powered by 6 AA batteries for portable recording too. I have one but I havent given it a field test yet.
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Sep 09, 2004 08:53 pm Ya, I looked at the MR8 but the noixe floor on it was a bit higher then the MD so I opted for the MD instead.
And ya the optical out ones are not cheap at all. In fact I havent seen one used ever escept on Ebay and it went for a couple hundred dollars used.
But like I said, I get really good results from the regular MD and then just transfer it out live via the analog in real time and then edit away in the PC.
Good find for $50.00 though!
DiemusikString benderMember
Since: Unknown
Sep 10, 2004 12:47 am Wow dont I feel like an idiot. After buying this thing I read the instructions and discover this minidisc recorder has no mic input but does have a line input. I hooked the NT1A up to the presonus and into the minidisc and got a very good sounding recording. So My question is has anyone used any of the battery powered mini-mics and do you think these would have the power to use in this application? Thanks guys.
Sep 10, 2004 10:52 am flame can i see your minidisc? got a link? i'm not entuirely sure what they are...
flame...bringing sexy backMember
Since: Jul 01, 2002
Sep 10, 2004 06:47 pm let me go find it forty...and diemusik, yeah i have but i wasnt that impressed with the one i used. you got one in mind?
flame...bringing sexy backMember
Since: Jul 01, 2002
Sep 10, 2004 06:52 pm heres what i use right now, but ya need a powered mic cos its only got a line in,no mic in. downside : you need a powered mic upside : lower noise floor. its good for the money, definately...
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Sep 10, 2004 07:27 pm I use a internally powered stereo condensor mic I got from Sony. I will have to look for the model number, but I think they still have em on their website.
But it works splendid, even though I do have a mic/line input. And it is a much better sounding mic then some of the others I tried.
I think it was about $75.00 US 2 years ago.
TadpuiI am not a crook's headMember
Since: Mar 14, 2003
Sep 10, 2004 09:53 pm I've got an SM-58 on a 10' cable, so I can't even take advantage of the superior acoustics of my cathedral ceiling in the living room.
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Sep 11, 2004 12:49 am Get somebody to stand on a ladder and hold the thing out ther while you record.
DiemusikString benderMember
Since: Unknown
Sep 12, 2004 11:09 pm Thanks everyone. I found more info about the powered mics on the links that Flame listed above. I think I'm going to try to build one of the powered mics from those links and if it doesnt work then I'll take a look at that mic that you listed Noize. Thanks again everyone.
Sep 13, 2004 12:57 am www.therealwaldo.com/archives/000018.html
I do a little ;)
I use an MD as well, although I run a 'real' condensor, or several, through boards and such usually first, but have been known to bring along tiny mics just go get the 'ambience' of something...
W.
Sep 13, 2004 08:54 am After reading this thrad I got an ideabased on what you guys said. I wonder if I could make a poor man's multitrack studio with a PC and MD.I have a MD(not NetMD though) and all I really need is a decent sound card and a decent micfor the MD.
Once I have these then recording sould be simple if not hard work. So would this work:
1. Create guide track from the pa out at the practise room.
2. Get each band member to play to the guide track, and record them all at different times.
3. Take em home and record into the pc.
4. Tweak em and then there's a basic multitrack.
Dos anyone see a problem with this idea?
flame...bringing sexy backMember
Since: Jul 01, 2002
Sep 13, 2004 09:46 am cant see anything wrong with that, its not idea, but ive done it exactly the same myself...
Sep 13, 2004 02:01 pm looks like a nice md, flame. picture makes me want to get one some day.
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Sep 13, 2004 08:57 pm forty, they can be had on E-Bay pretty cheap these days for the regular non mp3 types.
flame...bringing sexy backMember
Since: Jul 01, 2002
Sep 14, 2004 05:23 am the best one i ever owned was the sony mz-r70. theyre well made, take aa batteries and not some weird size, and they had an amplified mic input on them. brilliant!
i broke mine, sadly...
Sep 15, 2004 10:08 pm nice! i bought two condenser mic elements from radio shank today ($1.99 apiece). that's all i need, apparently, to make some ambisonic headphone mics!!!
the only thing is, the instructions on the back of the box show the need for a resistor (resistor required, it says) between one of the terminals and the rest of the wiring. the online instructions for the ambisonic mics themselves, however, mentions nothing of this. and those instructions use this exact same part (as indicated by the identical radio shabk cat #).
should i use a resistor or not? how does power flow through headphones anyway? tiny current down speaker wire, pulls speaker magnet toward and away from wound coil? and in mics, pressure moves magnet which inducts small current in coil?
i have a hard time believing these mic elements need a resistor unless i'm wiring them up to a powered circuit board with more voltage or watts or amps or whatever the &*%
DiemusikString benderMember
Since: Unknown
Sep 16, 2004 12:46 am Hey forty take a look at this page webpages.charter.net/tidmarsh/binmic/ This guy give a little better directions. The resistors are used to control the bias according to what this site says. I ordered a set of the panasonic elements from digikey that should be here in a day or two so I'll be trying to figure it out this weekend too.
Sep 16, 2004 01:50 am ack. i doubt i'll be able to understand that. and i took electronics in high school :( of course, i just got back from the bar so maybe its easier than it looks.
howwever, if the page i'm using is correct, the dude didnt need resistors at all. keep me posted on your results, diemusik. i aim to make these work.
flame...bringing sexy backMember
Since: Jul 01, 2002
Sep 16, 2004 10:53 am i think even if it does need resistors, it wont hurt to try without...its not like theres millions of volts going through there you gotta control...
Sep 16, 2004 12:01 pm right thats what i'm sayin. it might have something to do with the frequency response, if anything.
flame here's a question. your minidisc requires a powered mic right? i don't know anything about those, but how would you make ambisonic mics work with the minidisc? could you run them into a headphone amp and then into the minidisc or do i have the wrong idea about what powered mics are?
also, i heard parliament just outlawed fox hunting. is that true? how's that spin you?
flame...bringing sexy backMember
Since: Jul 01, 2002
Sep 16, 2004 12:25 pm the one im using now DOES require a powered mc, yes. the old one (from that ebay link, above) has a line in and a mic in, and thus doesnt. im using a little mains powered mic preamp at the moment, but as soon as i figureout a more portable way, ill let ya know...
as far as foxhunting goes, i think its a bit stupid for a load of people and dogs and horses to chase a fox til its too tired to run, then let the dogs kill it, so i think a ban was overdue. dont see the appeal myself. everyone who can afford a horse thinks its their god given right to do this, so theyre talking about trying to close major roads at rush hour, theyve stormed the house of parliament etc etc...as was expected.
its all stoopid if ya ask me...
DiemusikString benderMember
Since: Unknown
Sep 19, 2004 04:04 am Ok, I have been playing with my mini-mic's all day and here is what I have come up with. The mics that I have are Panasonic WM-61A. They say the operating voltage is 2-10 volts. The Minidisc that I'm using is a Sony MZ-S1 with line level input only but it will let you adjust the recording volume to some degree. I tried to wire these up with and witout the 10k ohm resistors and with a pair of potentiometers to play with the resistance. The best results were with the resistors and the 2.2uf caps. Witout the resistors I could get a signal at all. The only thing I can figure is the voltage was to high for the mics. The 9 volt battery actually measures about 9.49 Volts so thats pretty close to the 10 volt max on these mics. With the potentiometers it worked fine until I turned the resistance all the way down and I lost the signal again. So I dont know about the Radio Shack elements that you have Forty but these Panasonics wont work without the resistors. Now these mics work nice but I would still like to find a pre-amp because even though its clear as a bell the volume has to be maxed on both the record level and playback level to hear it at a normal level. Thats all for now guys!
flame...bringing sexy backMember
Since: Jul 01, 2002
Sep 19, 2004 06:23 am thanks for that dude, thats some useful info...
Sep 19, 2004 01:01 pm diemusik, can you explain why the resistor seems to be needed? thats what i am trying to figure out. in what way does power travel through one of these mic lines? i mean, i don't understand that at all. you've got your 1/8" mic input on the device on the one end and you have your mic elements on the other end. does your voice actually induce a tiny current in the line via the mechanical motion of the mic element in the magnetic field? or does a small current come up the line from the jack and get modulated or something?
i hear what you're saying about fox hunting flame. it's such a bit of culture, though! to be lost like that. on the other hand, who cares. i am ambivalent about hunting in general. on the one hand, i'm sure i would love being out in the woods in the fall, stalking things. but i don't feel right about shooting animals.
flame...bringing sexy backMember
Since: Jul 01, 2002
Sep 19, 2004 01:46 pm theres always paintball...
DiemusikString benderMember
Since: Unknown
Sep 19, 2004 07:02 pm Let me see if I can explain this. First of all these are condenser mic elements so just like a studio condenser they need power, or phantom power. Now a dynamic mic operates they way you described, the sound waves move the element in and out of a magnetic field creating a small current. I think the reason these seem to need resistors is the current is too much for the elements, over powering them. Now how the circut works is you come off of the positive battery terminal and go into 2 resistors, like a "Y". Then one resistor goes to the left terminal of the mic input phono jack and the other to the right. That supplies the power to the mic. Now off of those same terminals you wire in two 2.2uf caps. One to the left and one to the right. Those then connect to your output phono jack. The negative battery terminal just wires to the ground terminal of both phono jacks. I dont know if that helps or makes things more confusing! This diagram is a little easier to read than the other link I posted, see if this one helps. members.aol.com/MicDIYers/schematic.bmp
Sep 19, 2004 07:57 pm if this is true then that other site didn't know what it was talking about?
it said to use 2 condenser mic elements and basically just substitute them for your headphone speakers and VOILA! instant ambiphonic. if what you say is true and a condenser always needs external power, then his design couldn't have worked, as there was no power source mentioned. which makes him a liar?
this is the site:
art.simon.tripod.com/stealth.html
yes, flame. paintball. i have only so far played that indoors and it is indeed very fun and would like to get out to the woods sometime to try. but to do that properly i need to move back north. (to a real forest, none of these fake florida ones. some day!)
Sep 20, 2004 09:49 pm yes. dang. thats what that diagram on the back of the box means power source (and resistor) needed. i am completely befuddled as to how that feller got sound without a power source, using condensers.
DiemusikString benderMember
Since: Unknown
Sep 20, 2004 11:10 pm Hey forty I'm going to try to get this in but I've been having trouble staying signed on in this forum. It just occured to me that I havent asked you what type of mini-disc you were using. You might not need the resistors if you are using a mini-disc with a mic input that supplies power. The voltage and current are much lower with the on-board power. Mine only has line level with no power, thats why I had to build the battery box with resistors.
Sep 21, 2004 01:08 am i was going to use it with a variety of recorders. i dont own a minidisc, but i was thinking portable tape recorders.
most portable tape recorders use that built-in mic and they have a jack for another mic so i figured it wouldnt need a powered mic?
flame...bringing sexy backMember
Since: Jul 01, 2002
Sep 21, 2004 01:50 pm id assume that, yeah...
Sep 27, 2004 02:29 pm ok, then...let me...just...go ahead and...solder these mic elements...straight into where the...speakers used to...
...
..
(looks around waiting for someone to stop him)
zekthedeadcowEat Spam before it eats YOU!!!Member
Since: May 11, 2002
Sep 27, 2004 09:59 pm heh... let me tell you about my ribbon mic project there forty :)
start with block of wood... nail two alligator clips to it about 2 inches appart... solder wires to them...buy fake gold leaf at craft store and a 40lbs horseshoe magenet ar hardware... nail magenet inbetween alligator clips... cut leaf into a 1/4" wide strip...and then roll strip inbetween two gears to crinkle it... carefully clip each end in an alligator clip... (I stoped here) save $250 for a jenson transformer...wire transformer...
even without the transformer I was able to get a signal... not a useable signal...with like +70db gain...
Sep 27, 2004 10:37 pm why do you want a ribbon mic? im not sure what those are, even. god, they make 40 lb magnets for general use? haha so you're serious then?
HuePinnipedal Czar (: 3= Member
Since: Apr 11, 2004
Sep 27, 2004 11:03 pm Q: What does a 40lb. microphone record ?...
A: Anything it wants . LOL
He had to mean 40oz. ?
zekthedeadcowEat Spam before it eats YOU!!!Member
Since: May 11, 2002
Sep 27, 2004 11:29 pm heh no the magent can _hold_ 40lbs... it's small about 1"x1"x2" (those are inches :) ) I was terrified of droping it on my computer :)
...and now that this thread sparked my creative interest...I really need a shotgun mic on the cheap... maybe if I had a thick cardboard tube, a towel, and duct tape...
...this is all your fault guys...
ribbon mics are oldstyle broadcast mics... known for being really expensive, really fradgile, and for having awesome frequence responce 10hz-50khz or so.
...and before you ask :) a shotgun mic is a super directional mic like a Sennheiser ME-66
HuePinnipedal Czar (: 3= Member
Since: Apr 11, 2004
Sep 27, 2004 11:51 pm Wow, that's one strong magnet for it's size !
The local GC had an old ribbon mic for sale... it was re-built by Blue, and they wanted like 7800$ for it . It was a monster !
flame...bringing sexy backMember
Since: Jul 01, 2002
Sep 28, 2004 08:39 am Quote:
ok, then...let me...just...go ahead and...solder these mic elements...straight into where the...speakers used to...
try it! thats what id do, and sometimes stuff like that works...
zekthedeadcowEat Spam before it eats YOU!!!Member
Since: May 11, 2002
Sep 28, 2004 01:30 pm ...actually technically that should work... but it would be a speaker still... Bose flat speakers are based sort of on that idea...
Sep 28, 2004 07:13 pm i don't understand nothin'
flame...bringing sexy backMember
Since: Jul 01, 2002
Sep 29, 2004 01:16 pm deny everything!
only problem i can see is that the mics might need power to get a decent signal...
Apr 16, 2007 03:38 am how goes the binaural stuff, peeps? anyone ever have any luck building any of these mics?
i can't believe i was using the term 'ambisonic' back then. how lame.
i started looking into this stuff again. i may buy a pair of 70 dollar binaural in-ear mics. i'd still rather build a cheap pair, though. it still looks beyond me, however. unless i find some better plans or talk to someone here who's successfully built a set.
my new plan would be to use my italk thing (plugs into the bottom of my ipod) as the input to my ipod, which would be doing the recording. the italk has a mic input. which makes me think that i won't have to power whatever mics i build?
if someone could at least judge that assertion, i would be much edified.
Apr 17, 2007 10:33 am I record most of my stuff on location. Unaccompanied traditional singers are usually more relaxed at home than in a studio. I use my Fostex MR8HD 8 track HD recorder with a Rode NT1 mounted in an SE Reflexion Filter. The filter is a virtual vocal recording booth that screens out sounds from behind the mic leaving me with a very 'dry' recording which I can 'enhance' later. I also record live performances especially of a local choir. For these I add in my Focusrite TwinTrack Pro with just a touch of compression to catch those sudden unrehearsed loud bits!! I then use two NT1s, connected to the TwintrackPro's excellent mic pre-amps, as a coincident pair about 2.5m high just behind the conductor. The theory being that I get the 'mix' he is conducting.
Both these situations require power. For quite reasonable ad hoc recordings, I use a Sanyo ICR B180 Digital Stereo Recorder (ultra portable). It is fitted with a 1GB card (Sanyo only support 128MB but 1GB works fine) It gives me hours of CD quality recording especially if I use my little Sony ECM-MS907 stereo mic.
RigsbyUltra MagnusMember
Since: Nov 13, 2004
Apr 17, 2007 11:36 am Yeah, the 907 is a very cool cheap little mic, i've used those so many times. To be inconspicous though i have a little clip-on stereo mic, another Sony, ECM-717 which people don't notice like the do with the 907. I was recording traffic with the 907 once, standing by a busy road with the mic outstretched and the cars all started slowing down, the drivers were obviously thinking i was checking their speed.
RigsbyUltra MagnusMember
Since: Nov 13, 2004
Apr 17, 2007 11:36 am Yeah, the 907 is a very cool cheap little mic, i've used those so many times. To be inconspicous though i have a little clip-on stereo mic, another Sony, ECM-717 which people don't notice like the do with the 907. I was recording traffic with the 907 once, standing by a busy road with the mic outstretched and the cars all started slowing down, the drivers were obviously thinking i was checking their speed.
WaltChief Cook and Bottle WasherMember
Since: May 10, 2002
Jul 26, 2007 01:00 am Do quite a bit actually. My favorite set up is a decca-tree (two NT1's in a stacked coincidental pair with a pair of B1's slightly behind and to the sides). I use a small 4 buss mixer into an HD24.
flame...bringing sexy backMember
Since: Jul 01, 2002
Jul 26, 2007 05:17 am Wow, now this thread is a blast from the past!
I just got a new macbook for my business, and it's proving awesome for fieldrecording and doing stuff away from home. Its almost silent all the time, has a line in as standard and comes with Garageband, which is the best free audio app youre ever likely to find.
Aug 01, 2007 01:47 pm Hi Flame,
Interested to see that you're using a Macbook for field recording. Whic mic are you using?
Getting back into field recording after a long break. Just purchased an Edirol R-09 but disappointed at the amount of hiss it creates so looking for a less hissy solution.
