Dec 15, 2008 12:04 pm 37 too old? I hope not.
Looking for Direction New career Path.
Posted on Dec 15, 2008 11:55 am
TheZaphod042
Just Me
Member Since: Dec 13, 2008
Didn't know where to put this so figured here was good place.
I am considering taking a new career path, since my main field has been for the last 15+ years been in a computer tech area of some sort and that area is becoming vary small and not to rewarding..
So I have started to take a serious interest in Recording, mixing and such. Starting to build a small home studio for the family and self.
But here is the rub, I am 37, so I was wondering if anyone thinks I am a little to old for the game at this point. I love audio, grasp most concepts with little problem.
Also anyone have any recommendations on schools in the Chicago area?
Thanks
Dennis
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Dec 15, 2008 01:28 pm "Career path" is the only part that concerns me... The audio industry at this point is FLUSH with budding engineers - and no where for them to work. DIY is growing exponentially (as overall sound quality is dropping considerably, but that's for another thread), studios are going under one after another -
"Audio" is a big industry - RECORDING audio is gasping for air.
There's the "touch of reality" for the day.
That said - I'm certainly not trying to discourage setting up a studio - for fun and/or profit. But even the professional project studios - the really exceptional places with exceptional engineers with decades of experience are feeling the bite over the last decade. It's not what you want to rely on for a steady stream of income.
Acoustical engineering, system design and implementation, electronic circuit design/modification/repair -- Those guys are always going to be in demand.
Schools for recording arts around Chicago... Don't bother with a degree from Columbia (IMO)... Not that they don't have some fine, qualified students graduating, but most of them were fine, qualified engineers before they got there.** Of all the CC grads I know with degrees in audio engineering (dozens), I think one of them actually makes a living in a related field (and not at a recording studio). I know several who do a lot of "grunt" work (cleaning cables, assembling and ripping systems, loading & unloading trucks, live crew reinforcement, etc.), but very few who actually get to put their hands on the faders.
It's just not the place to be if you're not a single guy with a really good back in a one-room apartment.
Anyway - There are several studios downtown that offer basic recording skills classes - I think CRC still does them, Studio Chicago might have them - I'd look in the Entertainer and see what's listed in the back.
** Some time ago, I had an intern that was at CC who pretty much knew what time it was before he started there. We'd go over things he was being "taught" (quotation marks to indicate a certain amount of sarcasm) in class - Some very good "book" stuff and some amazingly ignorant "real world" stuff that made me wonder what some of those "teachers" qualifications were.
Up to and including "Track as hot as you can without clipping."
Oh yes, he was taught to overdrive his input chain on a normal basis. Seeing that in a manual written by some guy who's never seen a microphone in real life is one thing. Being taught that by someone with actual experience is mind-boggling beyond my comprehension.
Allegedly, allegedly, allegedly... :-)
Dec 15, 2008 01:31 pm Wasn't it a couple years ago the Hit Factory and a couple other big names closed some locations because so many folks started doing their own thing?
It's not an industry I'd be looking to for salvation from I.T...like MM said, not recording engineering and stuff like that. Acoustical engineering would be interesting and fun I'd think...
Dec 15, 2008 01:43 pm And handy - Every office building, hospital, school theater, movie theater, performing arts center, dance club, roller rink - anything with a PA system, needs someone who knows the ins and outs (no pun intended) of properly designing and implementing these systems and someone who can take a poorly acoustically designed space (as almost every space is) and make it acoustically viable.
Dec 15, 2008 01:59 pm I'll agree with that as well.
As a rule of thumb, as the economy worsens, the live sound industry does better.
Right now, where I work, it's almost as busy as the Summer. Clubs and Bar are killing in the live music. (Let's hope that this is the end of the D.J. era) Every place around here in Philly has a nightly act going on.
To make a switch in careers just to do recordings only, may wind up costing you more then you can ever recover in this economy.
Dec 15, 2008 02:57 pm Thanks for the input guys, I am not really looking to do it with a big focus on the big studios.
I was thinking more along the lines of freelance, or looking for work within the production department somewhere.
One area I was thinking of in a year or two when I get some decent understanding of it and better experience I would look into opening a small studio to cater to the small local bands only. Who knows though.
I was thinking that there would always be a need for qualified (good qualified) techs to run the audio at theaters, clubs, etc...
Also figure the small up and coming bands, that dont have a good sound guy could be a great market to hit on as well, Sorta A rent-a-Sound Guy thing.
dennis
Dec 15, 2008 06:39 pm Massive,
That is one major area I was thinking of getting into, But are you sure Columbia is bad? I looked into Flashpoint Academy in chicago and its 50,000 for the 2 year course, thats insane!
Dec 15, 2008 09:57 pm I'll back the statements made by those above. It is a bad time to try and go for doing this as full time job. Unless you have an in somewhere, and even that is not guaranteed in these times.
As Rob stated, the live sound guy is working hard around here as well. And the more qualified the better, and that is by reputation mostly.
Thanx to my two youngest sons I did a lot of work for young local act's. But being that many cannot afford too much, I gave more away then I took in. But having a good client base from around the globe made that possible. But as stated, times are hard now.
I work now strictly by word of mouth, no real advertising or the like. If you can slowly build up a reputation and get fairly steady work it isn't a bad way to go. But as stated, right now is not a good time to pack up on a 9 to 5 and try this out.
I would take it slowly.
As for the 37 thing being too old.
Absolutely not.
Dec 15, 2008 10:37 pm Quote:
I was thinking that there would always be a need for qualified (good qualified) techs to run the audio at theaters, clubs, etc...
True - But a decade ago when there were 10 engineers applying for every 1 job, now there are 150 for every 1 job.
Quote:
That is one major area I was thinking of getting into, But are you sure Columbia is bad? I looked into Flashpoint Academy in chicago and its 50,000 for the 2 year course, thats insane!
Let's not say "bad" I suppose - Let's just say that I've heard many, many things from many, many students that I disagree with completely and wholeheartedly. Some of it being really, really basic stuff (such as recording levels).
A few of them were so good that they were trying to tell me how to do my job on their first day. One thing they forget to tell some of the kids is to shut the hell up. One guy I had the displeasure of dealing with actually thought he was qualified to be AE1 for a rather gigantic organization that basically has their pick of the best FOH engineers on the planet - right out of school.
This guy could make a CD player feed back.
So, I can't say that CC is "bad" - But I can surely say that I've had consistently BAD experiences with CC students.
Dec 15, 2008 11:16 pm i missed out on the School of audio engineering course for this year because i was too late geting in, but have since then decided not to do it for alot of reason's stated above.
that, plus i dont think having a diploma or a ticket in the field means a great deal when trying to get work.
I guess its good if you have the experience behind you. But if you suck at it then the ticket means squat.
you suck you dont get a job.
the general feeling round here is there isnt bugger all work in this industry, so im not wasting me money, 10g's actually for 2 years.
just gonna go to tafe and learn there, for my own projects for 1g.
honestly,if i was in the area, i would rather pay some of the guys here to teach me things when they have the time.
Dec 16, 2008 12:00 am Deon, what you are saying, is how I got the bug to work in this field to begin with.
A good friend of mine, Bill Coe, is an electrical engineer that took me in to his fold.
Under his guidance, I learned everything that I know today. Without him, I would have never worked in this field at all. (Well, after 30 grand spent.... Maybe I should cures him! =P... Just kidding Bill!)
I really feel, that this is the best way to work in Sound Engineering. Having a mentor is the best way to learn how things really work. And it's not a classroom where you may feel like your question is to dumb to bring up. Or you feel that everyone else knows the answer to your question, and you are the only one that doesn't know.
Working for a small one man operation maybe a good starting place to learn the things that you thought that you knew. And the things that you didn't even know that existed.
If you can find such a place as this. I would say take it. Build up your rep. And that opens more doors then some piece of paper from some institution.
Dec 16, 2008 12:14 am Ya, here in Michigan even the crack dealers are moving out. Bars have been "No Pay" for a long time. If you can snuggle up to some bar owner you can do live sound for cheep and maybe sell a few live recordings to the bands if they have a buck or two. Recording is tanked. Everybody with a microphone, a guitar, and a PC is trying to record their own. Even beer can collecting and garbage rummaging is getting competitive. Wages for workers are constantly going down as the management sector tries to retain it's fat, but their dying off pretty quick too. B&E's are on the rise and the professional criminal sector is gearing up for when home owners have no protection with the new coming administration. If you can make the little RF receivers that catch car locking codes you can sell them as fast as you can make them. That's the latest industry. Catch the lock code, do a quick grab on the garage door opener and address and hit the house for the real goodies.
Dec 16, 2008 12:24 am Once again thanks for the input guys.
I know the current state is bad, (key word there is current) but in any field there are shifts in its economic presence. I am not looking to be doing this now, I try to look ahead a year or more.
The IT/Tech area is even worse then what you describe, for every 1 job there are about 500 people applying for it. In middle management (my other area) even with a solid Six Sigma cert, its bad.
Plus I wouldn't be dumping a current career, (company decided to make that decision for me Hey at least the Audio tech cant get Outsourced to India!) So I have some future planing to do.
As for the schooling itself, ya looking at costs vs return Not worth it, I think I might try to find someone local and try some networking with them first. (so if anyone knows of any decent guys that would like to have their ear bent for a few mins in the chicago area let me know)
For now I am just sticking with learning as I go, Which is quite fun. CuBase 4 is great, figuring out all the other stuff is the challenge, Compression, reverb, warm, soft, colors, gate, plates, etc... :)
It really is a good thing I love to read..
Dec 16, 2008 01:08 am Whereabout in the Chicago area particularly? I might know a few places that might be able to help to some extent...
Putting it a different way, you can spend $25,000 on schooling, or lock out a studio for an entire week for maybe $2500. One-on-one with an engineer for a week - Or once a week for over a month. "Real world" experience with an engineer that can teach you at your own pace while zeroing in on your strengths and weaknesses.
Dec 16, 2008 09:43 am I am about 40 miles north of Chicago, just about on the IL/WI border, if you are familiar with the area at all, Fox Lake, right in the heart of the Chain of Lakes.
Yea the schooling is going to wait, The local 2 year community college has a recording program as well but don't offer it until the fall semester so I will look into that next year, and by then should have a better understanding of all of it anyway.
When I taught computer classes at my shop a few years back that is what I would do with some of the students, I would have them come in about once a week and just work along side me with repairs and builds. I found that like myself, doing you learn more then listening.
Also going out this week to borders and seeing what books I can find on it as well.
Dec 16, 2008 09:45 am Find some local bands and offer to record a couple for free, have some fun, learn stuff...then start charging nominal fees...
Dec 16, 2008 12:11 pm dB hit it right on the head. I read alot of books , listened (key word) to as many working engineers, sound guys, ect and put together my home studio. after about 3 years of learning my equipment, I put out a fe craigslist adds to do 3 song demo's and what not for free. I built up a nice base in the bay area. Unfortunatly i had to move right when things were taking off.
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