May 13, 2008 10:47 pm Can you put up a sample of what you are getting. I use a TD-6 with a big custom Roland kit and don't have any issues with the sound at all.
Recording with my Roland TD-6
Posted on May 13, 2008 10:04 pm
jayarcola
Member Since: May 13, 2008
I have a roland kit. I love it and it sounds great through the headphones, but when i record with it, upon playback, it sounds like a different kit. I use a lexicon omega device with cubase. I hope I'm doing something wrong, because i feel like i wasted 2 grand on nothing. When I'm playing the toms sound so real its amazing, even the snare and kick sound great. I even recorded to my stand alone cdr and tape deck, and i'm still getting the same results. what am i doing wrong.
jayp
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May 13, 2008 10:47 pm Can you put up a sample of what you are getting. I use a TD-6 with a big custom Roland kit and don't have any issues with the sound at all.
May 14, 2008 07:44 am no i dont have anything saved yet, i noticed that i have pd85 toms and the module was set up for pd80, theres no choice for pd85 so i chose pd series and i get a different sound, but didn't experiment with it enough to see if i corrected my problem.
May 14, 2008 07:55 pm The different pads should not effect the sound. It will only effect the velocity that the brain unit can read coming from the pad itself. That setting simply allows the unit to use a pre determined set of parameters to optimize itself for the pad it is being triggered from.
May 14, 2008 09:10 pm i kinda figured that out. i dont have anything recorded yet, because i keep erasing it. how do you record with your td6? maybe i'm doing something wrong, or maybe something is wrong with the td6 module.
May 14, 2008 09:47 pm When I do use the sounds from the TD-6 I simply send the stereo outputs through my desk to the audio interface into the PC. I have used both the stock kit sounds and modified some of them to suit different music better. Things like getting rid of the reverb sounds and such. I've created several raw kits with the drum sounds that are in there. I also most times will simply use the midi out to control another drum synth like my Alesis DM5 or a software drum synth. The DM5 has much better samples, or I should say more of them to choose from. But that is a moot point as the TD-6 has some decent sounds as is.
I guess I should ask how you are recording them as well? There might be something in your signal chain that is changing them on the way in.
May 14, 2008 10:27 pm i'm going from the main outs of the td6 to a lexicon omega desktop usb interface with cubase to record. i'm using monster cables so ther's no bad signal. its weird, through the headphone out of the lexion they sound killer, but when i play them back, the drums have too much of an electronic sound to them, that they didn't have through the headphones, the cymbals sound great though, also the percussion sounds and other sounds are perfect, its just the toms and snare, the kick is decent, but not killer like it is hrough the headphones. [email protected] and i can send you something tommorow that i will record
thanks for your help. i called roland the idiot told me to try a direct box. yeah ok.
May 15, 2008 12:04 am have you checked you're sample/ bit rate that you're recording to? I record at 24/48 and I have a TD6 as well . I had a problem before becasue for some reason i had my sample rate on my audio card set to 22khz and that made a little difference.
May 15, 2008 09:28 am the bit rate don't matter because i tried recording to my cdr and even a tape deck and i got the same results.
May 15, 2008 09:30 am How are the levels when you are recording? What's wrong with the sound?
May 15, 2008 01:47 pm If you have input monitoring on in Cubase and haven't diabled Direct Monitoring on your interface that will cause the problem your hearing.
May 15, 2008 08:26 pm whats the interface, the lexicon? i'm new to the computer recording, but i've been recording and playing for over 15 years on a acoustic kit. if the interface is the lexicon, it will still wont sound correct because i recorded already bipassing the lexicon and came up with the same results. the drums sound one way through the headphone out of the td6, lexion, cdr, and tape deck, and another way after being recorded upon playback. its really strange because its just the toms and snare, the kick sounds ok and cymbals are on the money, and also the all the other sounds in the td6 sound fine, its just the drum sounds
May 16, 2008 10:21 pm i just added a sample recording of the drums. they way they sound in the recording is NOT they way they sounded through the headphone out of the td6 and the lexicon omega. i hope someone can help me, because i'm ready to take these vdrums and shove them up rolands ***.
May 17, 2008 02:19 pm I still think what your hearing is the signal some how doubled up in your headphones while recording. The kit sounds normal to me in the sample you posted. With some processing post recording you should be able to make it sound the way you want. The TD6 also has many Toms/Kicks/Snares you can chose from & mix/match if the ones you're using don't suit you, as well as tuning, ambience settings etc, to dial in the sound you're looking for.
Dan
May 17, 2008 05:20 pm i've not used the headphone out of the td6, i monitor the kit from my mixer i have them pluged into . it might be as simple as your headphones adding in some extra EQ bump. just a thought.
May 17, 2008 08:50 pm i've tried to re-eq the kit, different toms, snares, etc. and i still get the same results. the kit has too much of an electronic sound to it, i know thats its an electronic kit, but out of the headphones they don't really have that electronic sound to them. i was told that the td6 is famous for my problem, because of only 1 main out., thats what i'm told anyway. i'm sure that if i understood midi better, i can get the sounds i'm looking for. does the sensativity of the drums have anything to do with the sound being recorded. i also borrowed my friends mixer and ran that into my cdr, and i still get the same b-s. through the headphones of the mixer they sound incredible, but after they get recorded, its like night and day, theres that "electronic" sound again. so far i've tried all i can try.
May 18, 2008 02:47 pm Well midi has nothing to do with how the drums sound and no the sensitivity settings won't change the sound other than making the hits louder/softer with a given hit. But just like getting a great sound with an acoustic kit is no easy feat in a mix, it's not much different with the TD6 or any edrum kit. It's more than capable of good sound, though it does take some tweaking after recording to get the sound you're looking for and that's where the art of mixing comes in, using compressors, eq, delays etc.
I have no other ideas why it sounds different in your headphones while your recording other than what I've already stated.
Dan
May 18, 2008 03:33 pm i dont understand all this either. i got this kid thinking that recording to my computer will be a breeze and sounding really good, being that using a drum machine and my line 6 sounds killer through it. i dont think eqs and compression will help me. i just want the kit to sound the way it does when i use the headphones with the td6. the sound that comes through the headphones is a very real sound. when i researching the kit, i was on rolands site and heard there sound clips of the td6, and it sounds great, but nothing like i get when i record it.
whats the difference between master output jacks, and direct out jacks, thats what the back of the td12 has, and the td20 has master output jacks, and 8 direct out jacks. maybe using the 8 out jacks you get that awsome killer sound that your suppose to get.
May 18, 2008 04:07 pm Make the snippet you posted downloadable and I'll see if some post processing gets it closer to what you want it to sound like.
Dan
May 18, 2008 05:51 pm my snippet is downloadable. thanks alot
jay
May 18, 2008 06:01 pm hmmm i'm pretty stumped on this one myself.....the clip ya posted sounded like a roland kit...
i'm guessing you're hearing more of the impact and more reverb detail in the headphones...and it's not really jumping out at ya on speakers the same...
are you getting completely different sounds out of the headphones? or does it just not sound as good?
have you tried recording from the headphone output? i wouldn't recommend it, you're definitely recording it 'right'...like i said, i'm stumped
May 18, 2008 07:14 pm Here's the file processed a bit. It may not be the sound your looking for since I don't know exactly what that would be, but I think it sounds better. I'm not sure the tom's you used would have been my first choice but I think they'd sound okay in a mix.
www.smokinhq.com/dkemusic/music/td6drumsnip.mp3
The difference between the Main Outs and the Direct out's are each piece of the kit can be recorded separately which gives you alot more control over getting the sound you want since each piece can processed indepently. Now you can do this with the TD6 but it requires recording the midi output and then separating the individual tracks of the midi file (which sounds more difficult than it is :D
Dan
May 18, 2008 08:17 pm i tried the headphone out to record with, and still the same b-s. what you did (dan aka old dog) sounded awsome, but theres still that like trigger sound that you don't hear in the headphones. what did you do? it defentaly sounds better, and what tom choice would you use, all the others have that trigger sound, the one i use didn't, thats why i used it.., and yeah, the midi thing is not for me as of now, maybe later on.., but what program did you use cause it sounded alot better. thanks
jay p
May 18, 2008 08:23 pm Jay, there are a few things that can get it to where you want it. I do agree that the way it sounds in phones is probably going to have things boosted as most headphones do not have a flat monitor type sound. What headphones are you using by the way?
And here are a couple hints from my use of the TD-6. First I rarely use the toms tuned as they are stock. I retune them and as stated dump the reverb that they have onboard. Whether you believe it or not compression will make a huge difference to the sound that the recorded kit will give. That along with EQ as well.
Have a listen to how it sounds after OD beefed it up a little. It is a completely different sound.
Now onto the big key here. Adjusting the velocity curve and sensitivity to your style of playing is critical to get them to react like a real drum, and thus sound like a real drum. I think I know what you are hearing and it is from the hits being not articulate enough on the kit. Which is caused by the velocity being a bit flat and not reacting differently to the slightly softer hits. You need to have a curve that will cut fit your playing style. Which if it is a harder playing style without much variance in how hard you hit the curve must be really quick to go from soft to loud.
This does allow for a more realistic varied sound. The samples in the TD units are not just a straight up single sample that just gets louder and softer, each sample on one drum sound is made and cross fades into the next velocity sample as the hits go from soft to loud.
Now granted they are not as extreme as say my DM5 or DrumCore, BFD, Battery or the like, but they are good no less.
So it is really a matter of getting that part adjusted and then working the sound just as you would a real kit.
May 18, 2008 09:02 pm I would add, I've noticed with vdrums you shouldn't hit the pad really hard as this will cause an unnatural sound especially on the toms. Playing with Advanced Trigger settings especially the scan time can help on the tom's as well, this setting is kind of like an attack setting and can soften the intial hit on the tom so it sounds more natural, at least it seems to to me. :)
Second, don't judge the sound soley on how it sounds by itself, even if you had a great sound by itself it's likely it wouldn't sound so great in a mix. Get it into a mix and start tweaking the recorded drums and you'll probably find the little bit of 'trigger' sound your hearing will be gone.
I used Ozone to beef up the sample mainly because everything is in one plugin to do it, but you can do it with separate effects as well. I used some multiband compression, eq, and reverb. I did the mix in headphones, but I just listened on speakers and I'd probably cut a bit of the hi-freq if I did it again, but you'll be amazed at how many different sounds you can get out of the same kit with just a bit of proccessing.
As for which toms I use... I usually end up using the Dry1 t1,t2,t3. They have a bit more natural ambience than some of the others but in a mix they sound quite dry unless you want them to have big ambience (by using alot of send on the ambience setting) and they don't have the click sound that some of the others do.
Dan
May 19, 2008 09:35 pm i would like to thank everyone for helping me, i think i got it. i changed my toms, and snare, i added some compression and a little verb and it sounds pretty good, i'll be posting something when i'm done with it, my version of Darth Vader's Imperial March, i should be done with it by the weekend, i'm only 1 guy who works 11 hrs a day for NAPA AUTO PARTS, so i'm kinda limited on my playing time. just one question, what would give me better results, making the drums flat out of the td6 with no eq and verb, or with some. once again thank you so much for your help, you guys are great at this stuff.
jay p
May 20, 2008 12:53 am Glad you're making progress with it. Like anything it can be daunting when you first start with it, but after awhile you'll know which kit's sound best for what you want to do and what to do to them to get the sound you're looking for.
I usually leave the eq alone on mine unless it's really out of whack for the sound I'm wanting. I do cut back on the ambience and occassionally turn it off, but having some helps me play better (and I need all the help I can get with drums), kinda like trying to play a distortion guitar part with no distortion, adding it later, you can do it but it's not nearly as fun. ;)
Dan
May 24, 2008 05:22 pm i just added the imperial march, i totaly messed with the drums and got something different, the guitar gets messed up at the end but i really didn't care at that point, hope someone likes it.
jayarcola aka jayburner
May 24, 2008 10:33 pm MAn that is one huge sounding kick drum for sure. You only need to get the balance a little better on the levels of each drum and your golden with that one. By balance I mean the levels of each drum sound in the mix as the snare is a little louder then the rest of the kit. But as far as the sound itself that is killer.
May 28, 2008 10:18 pm thanks for that complement, i'm still working on the snare and toms, but i'm also working on doing a tympani, gongish kinda imperial march also.., but once again thanks for all the advice, i'm sure one day when i have alot of time to kill, i'll get that killer drum sound that i seek.. i miss my acoustic kit.
jayarcola
May 29, 2008 06:21 pm That's sounding really good, I agree a little work on the levels and you've got it nailed.
Dan
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