Political Signs on Church Property: Is This OK?
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Posted on Nov 01, 2006 07:27 pm
guitar_jim
Czar of Cheese
Member Since: Jun 09, 2004
OK, my wife and I (and kids) have started going to a new church. The old one was going down the shitter, and for various reasons, we needed a change. This new church seems to be much more conservative than our old church. Very literal interpretations of the Bible, and a lot of very fundamentalist, home schooling right-wingers. But my wife and I like the pastor, and the kids seem to enjoy the youth programs (which never happens in my house!) There are enough positives for me to attend church there, without getting too hung up with its right-ward leanings. Until now.
There are a couple of political campaign signs up in the church front lawn. Needless to say, they are for candidates that I don't necessarily support. Also, there's a sign endorsing a state constitutional amendment banning gay marriage. Without opening up that can of worms, suffice it to say that I am against such an ammendment. But that's not even my point.
Do you think it's OK for churches to support political candidates? (and constitutional amendments?) Does my attendance at that church imply my support for the candidates and ideals that the church endorses via political campaign signs?
This is a serious issue for me. Would I be out of line in approaching the pastor and telling him that I oppose the political signs in the church yard because they may or may not agree with my political views? Or should I just keep my damn mouth shut?
Jim
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Nov 01, 2006 07:41 pm I totally understand churches backing candidates that they support, I can understand why some people wouldn't, but on the whole, I guess they have as much right to their opinion as anyone. But then, you have as much of a right to voice your opinion to the pastor.
My family is currently starting to look at new churches as well, and it is a shame when they stand for something that all it's members don't.
The chick in front of my neighborhood, who has the neighborhood sign in her yard, put a politcal sign in front of the neighborhood sign, which bugs me cuz it's for somebody I surely don't support...and I can almost promise most of the neighborhood doesn't.
Nov 01, 2006 07:52 pm And I don't know the inner-workings of the church well enough to know who's decision it was to put the signs up. Is it a case of the few trying to express the opinions of the many? I suspect it is. On the other hand, there don't seem to be too many people around there that think the way I do (thank God for that!)
zekthedeadcowEat Spam before it eats YOU!!!Member
Since: May 11, 2002
Nov 01, 2006 08:32 pm What type of church is it?
Political anything at my church (episcopal) wouldn't fly... we might go into sidebars on local politics where people would ask if village counsular soandso is causing building permit problems for us, etc. But a sign in the yard is a definate no-no.
I also grew up in an episcopal church where a substitute pastor preached that women belong in the kitchen :0
I just want a church that will give me the information I need to make good choices in my life... not make those choices for me.
Nov 01, 2006 09:02 pm i think politics and religion are still pretty close, and therefore i'd say it's justified (espically on the gay marrage issue)...you're only way of 'supporting' would be to vote against it, attending a church that has such signs dosn't hafta mean you agree....i wouln't bring it up to the pastor or whoever, cuz i will bet my left nut they will try to convince you to view it their way on the spot. which will only annoy you. take the path of least resistance my friend....i've sat in on several sermons and damn near EVERYONE of 'em had politics intertwined in them. call it 'way of life' or call it 'social engeneering' they're both too close to eachother.
i'd live and let live, and prolly keep my mouth shut about it to fellow members, it's a real touchy subject for them. hmmmm new thread?
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Nov 02, 2006 08:54 pm Yep, I agree as well. The signs dont mean that everyone supports the decision of the church. It seems like everyone is looking for a new church these days. We have been for about 6 months now. And the funny thing is we may end up going to one I avoided because of it size and the nature of their collection plate policies. I donnt like being made to feel guilty when I dont give what they consider I should be giving. And our old church got to that point. The paster even implying I should be doing more for the church with what I have been given.
And for the record, the studio payed for half of the organ they bought 3 year ago. And at that time, I felt it was a worthy cause. But after that he assumed I should be giving so much more. We were allready giving as much time as most of the major contributers were giving.
But I digress. The signs in front of the church really shouldn't reflect what the congregation feels, and I dont think the public would look at it that way. I could be wrong, but you can indeed make it clear of your feelings to get it out in the open.
zekthedeadcowEat Spam before it eats YOU!!!Member
Since: May 11, 2002
Nov 03, 2006 05:13 pm it aso depends on who owns the church property.
Ours is pending a loan from the Diocese, then the mission council would own it. However it only costs $50 to call yourself a pastor so a lot of independent churches, where the pastor owns everything, pop up... sometimes they get closed down... Indianapolis Baptist Temple was a big one... it apparently wasn't even a non-profit... though I bet most of the congregation didn't know that.
BeerHunterwww.TheLondonProject.caMember
Since: Feb 07, 2005
Nov 03, 2006 05:36 pm IMHO I don't beleive that there should be political signs on church property. I guess the only exception would be if the political candidate was a member of the church (and has been for some time).
Nov 03, 2006 05:38 pm well, freedom of speech and all...
BeerHunterwww.TheLondonProject.caMember
Since: Feb 07, 2005
Nov 03, 2006 05:43 pm True, but if I was the pastor I wouldn't want my congregation devided over politics.
Nov 03, 2006 05:46 pm Well, if I was President I wouldn't want my country divided either, but it happens. In theory, people of a similar religion, or from the same church likely have much more similar political leanings than you would see in society. Though there will always be some differences.
Nov 03, 2006 10:43 pm Signs notwithstanding, I would be very wary of any church that uses "literal" bible interpretations. We all know how dangerous that can be.
Nov 04, 2006 10:11 pm I think the main reason is to keep the reason why we go to church paramount. I would keep church and state sepearte, because it will eventually lead to division (1 Cor) and that is not good for anyone. If you still feel led to stay there, then by all means, but if the political mumbo jumbo becomes a distraction, I would leave. I would wait until after the elections to see if things die down a bit, it might have something to do with the protest as well. As for giving, it is writtin that we should give, but if it is force upon you by the preahcer, that just isnt right. I am in the USAF and I found out one day that our chapel was supporting the 1st Sgt xmas party, so since then I stopped giving offering but I found other ways to donate, for example, I bought our band a new set of xlr cables, which was much needed. But anyways, you shouldnt be forced to tithe like that, that not really biblical, to say the least. Works and money wont get you into heaven.
Nov 06, 2006 04:23 am from what i understand, tithing has nothing to do with 'buying your way into heaven'. the point of tithing is to understand what it feels like to be a 'giver'....it teaches you to give, to the point of where you want to do good to give more......god will not think any less of who you are, based on weather you tithed, that's just another 'lesson'...but i digress...(gosh that's fun to say)
there is no such thing as a 'forced thithe'...but i do view 'supporting your church financially' as the EXACT SAME THING as tithing, it just depends where your head is at. so the question is, "do i give ppl money to support a view i do not have?".....this is a WHOLE new subject....you can shop at walmart, or buy fruit/veggies off the guy on the side of the road.....but again i digress....
i say, you gotta call it based on what you/your family get out of the church....if much 'goodness' comes outta it, then i'd bite my tungue, and carry on....but if this is a common 'subject' that comes up frequently in sermons (here comes the religion vs. social engeneering) then i'd shop a new church...i'm sure all are just as 'individual' as other 'small businesses'...not to say they're the same, but that's how i view them, they provide a service....ya got yer huge muti-million dollar 'congrations' that got their stuff broadcast NATIONALLY that are the 'glam-god' kings....but it's the 'small business' hometown congrations that yeald the best 'customer service'...go figure....again, i digress.
talk it over with your wife/family...and put it on a scale of 1-10 on how big of an issue this for you....it's ok to disagree, but i could understand if this is a reoccuring thing....if that's the case, shop around for a better fitting group of like-minded people, i'm sure they're out there.
but if all in all, things are good there, be the better man, and quietly cast your vote without makin' a big deal outta it (although i, myself, must admit, is hard to do).
Nov 06, 2006 04:53 am Agreed, tithing is a lesson and kickback of a sort. God has so blessed you with something, give some of it back to God's house. That's how I look at it. I don't strictly tithe by any means, but I figure for the use of the church, my kids going to Sunday school and such things, I should help support it.
Though I have found that with most churches (the one I go to now doesn't seem to be this way) the "tithing" stories come out in sermons right aroudn the time they start taking pledges and setting budgets for the upcoming year.
What bugs me most about my church isn't that they bug you and bug you for money, because they don't, but they seem to have little fiscal responsibility. They keep building things (currently a retirement/nursing home) that they are not fiscally able to handle, just assuming God blesses their mission and will provide.
Nov 06, 2006 04:55 am yeah i feel the same way when NPR/NPT does the fund raisers!
