Adobe Audition (formerly Cool Edit Pro)
Home > Home Recording Forum > Recording Techniques > Adobe Audition (formerly Cool Edit Pro)
Posted on Dec 12, 2003 10:26 pm
scrump775
Member Since: Aug 30, 2003
Hello All,
Anyone know the ins and outs of this program?
Recommend or not? Any specifics would be greatly appreciated. Thanks
[ Back to Top ]
WaltChief Cook and Bottle WasherMember
Since: May 10, 2002
Dec 12, 2003 10:53 pm I have it. I use it. That is old CP 1.1. I use the graphic equalizer to bring mics flat sometimes. I use it to trim sections, amplify small sections, do some fades. There is a noise reduction routine in it that will sample room or line noise and if used carefully will remove it and leave the audio in good shape.
I can't tell you why, touch, feel, appearance, sound, but if feels a bit toy-esk in comparison to say Cubase SX. I wish I could better qualify that. It is a super easy wave editor to use. It's like the "almost there" program.
olddogMember
Since: Jul 02, 2003
Dec 13, 2003 01:18 am I use CEP 2.1 which is what AA is, If you don't need midi support, DXi (it does support DX plugin's), or VST support it's IMO probably the best value out there and is as capable as any for multi-track recording and the wave editor is top notch. It's a much improved program from CEP 1.x.
Now that Adobe has it, I don't know that I'd recommend it over the likes of Sonar or Cubase, if price isn't an issue, since I don't know what direction Adobe will take it. It is still cheaper than either of those, and is closer out of the box to including everything you need and then some, from recording on thru to mastering. My advice is to try them all before you make your decision.
Dan
Dec 13, 2003 06:04 am Actually, I am very much excited that adobe took it, I have higher hopes for it. Syntrilium always seemed complacent and I thought CEP was a decent program and all but by no means earth-shattering-cool...but Adobe is an industry leader in everything they touch, graphics, film, print layout...I am guessing they want CEP to marry to their video editor, Premiere. Maybe not one app, but make them work together well and cover the gamut of those industries. Adobe does nothing "small" I suspect CEP will be cooler than ever after they have a chance to Adobe'ize it.
Dec 13, 2003 11:10 am Thanks,
Price isn't an issue because my neighbor works for adobe... Hey dB, do you know if it has basic guitar fx (reverb, distortion/compressors)and gates, etc for drums? If not, how can I add those on? Some links from this site?
How about ease of use for a newbie? Like I have said before, I am a transitioning Yamaha 4416 user (stand alone recording unit) and am approaching this with research and caution.
My laptop is only 654mz and supposedly won't support cakewalk (advertized as 800 minimum).
Pretty soon I'll have taken the plunge on purchase (leaning towards the MOTU 828 mk II) and Audition. Hey Olddog, can you tell me in brief laymans terms what VST support is? I looked around and can't find the answers. It will suport dx midi but not the updated dxi midi is that part of the answer up there? Or no midi at all? All I want to do with this gear is record/mix master (good luck for a newbie...) my local band and maybe put music to video files...
Dec 13, 2003 11:17 am From Adobe's web site:
"Work with more than 45 digital signal processing (DSP) tools and effects, mastering and analysis tools, and audio restoration features. Adobe Audition also supports third-party DirectX plug-ins."
There ya go, it has 45 effects with it, pls you can use any DirectX plugin, of which there are hundreds.
CoolEdit Pro was well known for it's ease of use, however, from my experience with Adobe, while building "best of breed" applications, they are not known for their ease of use. SO I guess ease of use will depend on the direction they take it.
VST support means that the program is able to use plugins (effects) and virtual instruments (software synths and such) that are built on the VST standard. DirectX is the same thing, just another standard. These standards are in place so anyone can make add-ons such as plugins and softsynths that will work in any supporting "host" program such as Audition, Sonar, Cubase, etc. Does that help at all?
olddogMember
Since: Jul 02, 2003
Dec 13, 2003 12:23 pm The thing that worries me about Adobe taking over is that they will most likely be concentrating on improvements that relate to use in there products. For instance they don't consider midi, vst, or VSTi, DXi support to be a priority. It's going to become geared toward video IMO. Now I don't consider any of the things as mandatory simply because I have no use for them, but to compete with the likes of Sonar, Cubase etc, those are going to have to be added at some point if they are to remain competitive. The Syntrillium team are still the main guys working on it though, so I guess there is hope. :) Then there's the issue they pissed me off cause while they gave CEP 2.x users a free upgrade to AA (commendable), they also forced us to keep CEP installed in order to install the upgrade, and if you ever reinstall you'll have reinstall CEP first (BS). I had purchased CEP 2.1 less than a month prior to Adobe taking them over. So at some point when it's time to upgrade I'll be looking hard at probably Sonar to replace CEP.
Scrump: The midi support is limited to triggering things in the program, you can't for instance record a midi track, though you can import one. It can function as a midi Master or Slave for timing. No DXi support means you can't use directX instruments inside AA, such as drum synth's etc, but you can use things such as Ozone which is a DX plugin for mastering.
Effects wise AA is loaded and most of the effects are of very good quality. You have compressor/limiter, frequency splitter (used for things like multi-band compression and effects) gates, reverb (ranging from quick reverb to a fully controllable one), delay's including mulit-tap, one of the best and most controllable chorus effects I've ever seen/used, pitch/time effects and a ton more. Look over the list on AA's site and if you have questions about a specific one I'd be happy to give you more info.
Dan
Dec 13, 2003 01:13 pm From dB, "does that help at all?" What are you kidding? Enourmously. You guys rock. For 25 bucks I think I'll give it a try!!!!
I did find the .pdf file on AA, it told me a lot of what you guys mentioned above. But you guys put it in laymans terms, much more understandable...Thanks a lot. Now how about the MOTU 828? Thanks fellas...
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Dec 13, 2003 09:59 pm For someone who is building his first DAW, I would say that the 828 is bit of a large plunge. You could do much better without all the bells and whistles on it.
Are you going to run an ADAT recorder, will you be running word clock, are you going to be pumping any digital sources in or out. If the answers are no to any of these, I would suggest starting with a good card from M-Audio or the like to get you started. You will probably find the alter type card to be more then sufficiant for your needs as they do offer cards with multiple ins and outs for much less money then the 828.
Dec 14, 2003 12:35 am Hey Noize,
What would your suggestion be if I am trying to record drums to a laptop? I can't find anything with the amount of ins that would properly record 8 inputs... The echo layla requires mic pre's, so by the time I do all the add ons, might as well do the 828. What else is out there with 8 inputs? I could get a card (firewire 410) from M audio, however I am stuck in that case dealing with mixing 7 tracks down to 4 thru my beringer mixer which in reality seems more limiting and more work than just 8 thru the motu. Or I would have to do more than one take on the drum lines, pain in the butt. I really would appreciate any sugesstion because I am not planning using adat, midi, or word clock. What is out there which will suit my needs that works with a laptop and can record so many tracks simultaneously? I thought I did my research, but maybe not, something out there without all the bells and whistles, yet that will fulfill my needs? Maybe should've kept the Yamaha? Or will I get better results this way? Probably a rhetorical question, depending on who I'm asking...
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Dec 14, 2003 07:07 pm I gotta say its my bad here. I forgot you were going to be using the laptop for your main rig. After looking around for several hours at all the differant rigs out there that might do the trick, alas only a few have USB or Firewire support and include 8 analog i/o channels. Now the 828 does only have 2 channels with mic pres though, so I hope you werent thinking it had mic pres on all the inputs. And after checking the laptop Layla, the MOTU would be the better bargain. The other alternative would be to stack a pair of M-Audio USB interfaces up, which is very easy to do since their hardware plays very well together when running multiple devices. but in the end, I guess it will come down to the fact that if you want 8 channels of drum mics coming in, then the 828 might be just the ticket. I did not however notice if the 1/4" analog i/o was balanced or not. and you will want to get good cable converters for the mic cables to convert them to 1/4". Using cheap ones can induce some noise and such.
As far as having kept the Yamaha, yes that might not have been a bad idea. I will always prefer to use a mixer for multiple channels, just for the extra control it allows.
I will take a little longer look tommorrow at a couple of other alternatives, but I think you might be stuck along the lines of the 828 anyway.
Dec 14, 2003 11:41 pm Thanks Noize,
Yes the quarter inches are balanced. It has mic pres on only the 1/2 inputs, does that mean that I need mic pres on all the others or that I just can't run condenser mics into those inputs without mic pres? In other words, no matter what mic I run, do I need mic pres? Or am I confusing phantom power (condenser mic) with mic pres....or is it one in the same? And when you say about keeping the Yamaha, you are aware it was one of those digital audio workstations not just a mixing board? I still have a 8 channel beringer... Thanks, Mark
WaltChief Cook and Bottle WasherMember
Since: May 10, 2002
Dec 15, 2003 06:35 am Scump,
Phantom power is power provided to a condensor microphone that it needs to operate. A Dynamic (or at least most) need no power to operate.
All microphones produce a relatively small output and need to be amplified to a line level for audio equipment to work with their signals. This is the function of the mic pre-amp.
Many units e.g. mixers, pre-amps, control surfaces, etc. will offer switchable phantom power on all channels equiped with mic pre-amps making those channels prepared for both dynamic and condensor microphones.
To further complicate things many Direct Injectiomn boxes will take an input form a guitar pick-up with a fairly strong signal and output it to a microphone level. These units too need a mic pre-amp; but please no phantom power.
Phantom power equiped channels must have balanced cords to work with as well.
Just a lot of fun combinations!
Dec 15, 2003 08:06 am Thanks Walt-
I am aware of the phantom power requirements, and hi-z inputs, however will a dynamic mic always need a pre amp to bring the output level to a useable level? Will I need it for all drums or is the line level input workable threshold depending on the instrument? The most basic question is, will I need to buy a separate set of mic pres to run into the non preamp inputs in the motu to get it to record? I guess I can always run the mic cables into my beringer mixer first right? Or will that add a lot of noize? Its a beringer 2642 16 channel mixer, about 300 bucks at Guitar Ctr...thanks
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Dec 15, 2003 05:44 pm I guess most questions were answered but yes the mixer you have I believe has inserts for each channel which can be used for direct outs to the audio interface by only pushing the 1/4" jack in to the first click. It really wont introduce any noticable noise into the signal chain by going through the board first, and yes it is good to have pre amp on all the channels as mic level signals giong direct into the 828s regular 1/4" analog ins will be pretty well below a good input signal.
Dec 15, 2003 06:21 pm Thanks Noize,
If it is not noticeable noise, I guess I can spend a few less bucks and get the 828 mkII versus the 896, use the mic pres from the mixer and save some dough. Anyone know the big diff between the 896 and the 896HD?
WaltChief Cook and Bottle WasherMember
Since: May 10, 2002
Dec 15, 2003 08:09 pm Scump,
Sorry bout the elementary response back there. Got confused on the question. I looked at the two 896 postings in MF and it appears one has 192Khz inputs vs 96 on the other. Where it me, I would definately call MF first and get the complete skibby. Does this mean that expansion is limited? Or is there just no down side to the 192Khz unit beyond possible overkill with the host software?
Oh by the way. Totally concure with Noise. Especially if you have the direct outs on your mixer. Very little noise added. I have the MX9000 with direct outs and compared to all of the other noise generators out there, cords, pick ups, room noise, on and on we go, the MX adds absolutely none. For me it is almost impossible to get buy without a mixer in the middle as I always end up providing sound reinforcement for groups as I record them in some fashion. Basicly get right in the middle of things and tap off what I want for the recording. It has proven invaluable.
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Dec 15, 2003 09:35 pm Walt covered it all except that the 896HD does have pre amp on all analog inputs and the 828 only has two.
Dec 15, 2003 11:38 pm Thanks guys,
Finally some good news. I guess I'll get the 828mkII and save a few $$$. I'll use the mixer for the pres where needed. Noize, I was just curious what the difference between the 896 (discontinued, but available on ebay) vs the new 828HD was? Couldn't find on the web site and when I called 2 places they talked to me in some foreign language (techno speak)... Something about cue and latency? Probably way too much than I need and care about at this point. Anyway-off to Seoul for a few days, thanks for all the help guys, you've really helped me make some decisions here. Now once I get this stuff, maybe a lot more q's!!!
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Dec 16, 2003 03:56 pm The big differance is really pretty small. It is a combination of drivers used and the actual hardware itself. It is a small differance, but still noticable differance in the way the unit handles latency. The HD of course is built to comensate better for the latency/timing issues prone to most hardware expecially multi channel units of that size. It is also a matter of getting all the inputs to run in sync with each other when playing back and recording at the same time. They have developed their hardaware to allow you to record into the digital channels while the analog plays back, or any combination there off.
WaltChief Cook and Bottle WasherMember
Since: May 10, 2002
Dec 17, 2003 05:23 pm Finally took a look at the Adobe site. Looks to me like Audition will be a video add on. All good. Just a radical change of direction. For my needs CEP was an affordable wave editor. I think now it is out of the running. Down to Waves and Wave Lab.
