getting audio spikey bits down.
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Posted on Jun 21, 2011 02:16 am
Dematrix
http://www.reverbnation.com/2ndg
Member Since: Nov 27, 2007
Been trying to do a tad of, not so much mastering, but getting the volumes on my end product to be a little more smooth so i can get it louder.
Just wanted to know how to go about compressing the peaks down to an acceptable level without making it sound so obvious that it sticks out.
Ive been trimming i guess you could say, a little bit at a time but they still seem to be there.
started off using an attack 0f 15 odd ms with a 1:6 ratio and a modest threshold, so not a great deal of GR was there, but the little that was, was reasonably constant.
Then i imported it into my project again and checked the waveform, still going nuts a bit in some spots, so a similar approach to the first time, but with a later attack time around 45ms and a 1.6 ratio again.
this time the GR metre was only on the real peaks.
So bounced it and imported again for a look at the waveform, and still it could be more uniformed and im not sure where to go from here.
any pointers?
Just makes it hard when i use the limiter if its spiking away too much, it kinda squashes it, and then when i turn the limiter input down, it loses the vol im wanting.
I dunno if im even approachng it right or not, but this is where im at with it.
please gimme some pointers if you can.
Cheeeerrs.
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cruxTypo SzarMember
Since: Jul 04, 2002
Jun 21, 2011 07:34 am Ur eyes maybe seeing spikes caused by transients like a snare hit, a pick attack or something, but that doesnt necessarily mean thats wat ur compressor sees. The biggest problem i find with compressors on the stereo track r that they are triggered almost exclusively by low end material, low end stuff that doesnt necessarily translate to spikes on the waveform.
just as an experiment, try severely low-shelving ur track, really tuck the low end under ur mid and high and then compress and see how much louder u can go, or even how flat u can get ur waveform.
If u can, then its likely ur bass elements are obstructing ur compression.
Dematrixhttp://www.reverbnation.com/2ndgMember
Since: Nov 27, 2007
Jun 21, 2011 08:01 am yeah dude i think yer on there.
As i mentioned i ran it thru a vintage compressor first, and at some point i ran it thru (as MM calls it) a maul the band compressor and manged to get things a bit nicer with the bass by basicly keeping it at bay somewhat, and yep seemed to make it betterer.
I dunno how much i destroyed the song now, but its nice and loud and "i think" is ok audio wise with only a smidge of crushing here and there in spots, mainly rolls, but it kinda sounds part of the parcel being heavy **** ya know?
I will post it. Maybe have a squiz, without being too picky of course, i got about a 2% idea of what im doing. hahaha.
if you read this MM, sorry mate, i just couldnt get the money together from band members to get things mastered so i had to attempt to get it loud and be happy with it this time round.
Jun 21, 2011 08:02 am If you have a random few major spikes, you could try redrawing those waveforms if you have an application that allows redrawing...that could help, then compress when you get rid of the major spikes.
cruxTypo SzarMember
Since: Jul 04, 2002
Jun 21, 2011 11:46 am I'm learning day by day that if u cant afford to master, afford urself the time to REMIX LIKE THERE IS NO TMR
where ur equipment cant really coax the song to where a mastering engineer can, u can actually go back and fix things in the mix to great results.
I use HarBal almost mainly as a kind of spectrum analysis, studying my mixes and comparing them to commercial tracks and figuring out wat elements are off. More times than not its the low end ill tell u, not so much that other elements r right, but that the low end out of whack will not let u judge the upper parts of teh spectrum.
So instead of trying to fix stuff on the stereo track, if, lets say ur bass is overpowering ur mix, go back to ur mix and figure out how to fix that. If u can get ur mix down sounding great, I find u can bypass the tedious compressing and just go straight to a limiter, bring up ur track and be done.
Dematrixhttp://www.reverbnation.com/2ndgMember
Since: Nov 27, 2007
Jun 21, 2011 08:37 pm exactly what i did mate, great minds huh?
My guitar top end was totally destroying everything, dint sound that bad in the mix but once you start with the loudness treatment man, BANG! Death in a instant.
A few dudes round this neck of the woods actually do their mastering in sections, ie; drums, guitars, bass, vocals in their own little windows, which is what i tried, but only a little bit on the compresion etc, seems to work alright.
Then import the whole thing into a seperate mastering proji.
Moral of the story, nothing new, we're being constantly reminded of it...
Get your shiz right before you record!!!
guitars especially, a ***hot guitar sound, X4, sounds like yak, then there's no way back unless you scoop scoop scoop, not nice sounding.
Dematrixhttp://www.reverbnation.com/2ndgMember
Since: Nov 27, 2007
Jun 22, 2011 03:03 am so thanks for all the points of view on this. Its helped me no end.
I will try host the songs somewhere and you can have a sus and tell me what you think...if you would be so kind?
Actually i can throw one up here but the other one is too big a file.
Hey dB i need to 2 more meg so i can fit long songs on.
: )
Ps i hate the giy with big grin in the ad below, niot sure uf you guys get this add or not.
Jun 27, 2011 11:09 am Try a lower threshold(start with-20dB) and at least a ratio of 8:1 and a longer release(above half a second),allow the compressor to gentle squeez 2-3dB off everything, should tame things down a bit for you,then up the gain till nearly hitting the clip, if it's drum hits that are causing the spikes, add a good limiter(wavesL1,ultramaximiser or such) should help too.
BTW:~upload .wav files(up to 300mb) to 'sendspace',
it supports browser playback:
www.sendspace.com/file/xdnc2s
~this is some cheesy backing track for a traditional Irish reel (ala reason)
Jun 28, 2011 01:12 am 8:1 is pretty severe limiting -- Not a "gentle squeeze" (especially depending on the threshold).
Dematrixhttp://www.reverbnation.com/2ndgMember
Since: Nov 27, 2007
Jun 28, 2011 01:56 am 8:1 is a massacre, not really a mastering ratio i would have thought.
each to his own tho.
isnt 8:1 gonna give you alot more than 2 to 3dB of reduction tho?
end of the day tho now i dont even remember collectively what my reduction was overall. I was going a bit by knowledge and alot by ear with the compression.
On the multiband though, i was doing no more than 1:7 ratio but some threshold. Bass was more thresh than the rest tho.
I basicly put the song thru a vintage comp first then thruthe MBC to neaten it up. then a limiter.
seemed to be constantly notching out the 1k ish area all the time even when i hit the limiter.
not really mastering so much as just getting the little s**t as loud as i could.
one question tho, and maybe Ace O B youre heading in the right direction i dunno,
but, anytime i and mates have ever tried get stuff real loud using a limiter its only possible to get it so loud before it starts getting smashed.
why is that?
maybe more heavy comp is needed so the level doesnt move, i dunno.
cruxTypo SzarMember
Since: Jul 04, 2002
Jun 28, 2011 07:51 am Any ratio will give u any reduction depending on the threshold set. The difference will be in how that reduction is carried out, smoothly or in a brickwall type way.
The reason u can only compress to so much loudness as far as i understand is dependent on multiple factors, such as I stated previously about the bass end, which at some point will send ur compressor into crazy movement that affects the undulation of ur other bands. Also, a sound can only be compressed so far before unwanted artifacts and even components of that sound come up too far in the mix.
Im sure there is a ton more, but yeah... its alot of stuff
Keith WarrenMans reach exceeds his graspMember
Since: Oct 23, 2007
Jun 29, 2011 12:44 am I agree with Crux, pre-mix the crap out of it. The true value in having your own studio set up that you can spend all the time you want in any stage of the process. You own, you've paid, you do! Freedom!!
If it's down to compression, there's an awesome article in the tip section here you may or may not have not checked, the link is here- www.homerecordingconnecti...ory&id=1470
Fundamental? Perhaps. Applicable? Always!
But as I always tell others, don't worry if your track is loud, just be sure the musicianship is there. If the song is good, they'll turn it up!
Perfect example, Muse. Their first two albums I bought from over seas and they were mastered differently than American. I Turn that stuff up every time. Another great example is Lykke Li, an AMAZING female indie artist from Sweden. I love almost every song her album. It's not set to 11, in fact it's set to about 8. True props to her producer for that!
Volume 11= loss of clarity.
My 2 cents.
