Patch Bays
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Posted on Feb 23, 2004 08:12 pm
Loki
Cone Poker
Member Since: Apr 07, 2002
Alright I got a patch bay now and have hooked the outs and ins of my mixer and soundcard into it... but man do these things eat up cable. I Don't have enough cables to use the patchbay and play an instrument at the same time, so it kind of defeats the purpose.
Also I have NO idea how to hook this thing up, I ran the outs of my soundcard into the top of the patch bay, and the bottem of the patchbay into the ins of my mixer, then I ran patch cord from top 1 to bottem 2... when it's like this I hear the audio from the computer, but when I unplug both ends, I still hear it but only from one speaker
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Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Feb 23, 2004 08:58 pm You can find the 12" 12 lead packs from Hosa for about $8.00 at most music stores. They are pretty reliable and are meant just for that. In a pinch you can use stomp box jumper cables as well.
Did you get the Behringer, they have a detailed layout that shows differant routings for the pathc bays to be used? I think there might be a link to a page showing layouts in the forums somewhere, not sure exactly were though.
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Feb 23, 2004 09:15 pm Loki I found the link to the page at Behringers site. Download the PDF file and there are some good starting points in there. www.behringer.com/02_prod...00&lang=eng
Feb 23, 2004 09:16 pm yeah man get SHORT cables! i hate rat's nests!
LokiCone PokerMember
Since: Apr 07, 2002
Feb 23, 2004 10:56 pm Noize- I got the actual patch cables, those aren't a problem, what I need is the longer cables to run from the back of my mixers and effects to the back of the patch bay. And I went to guitar center and they didn't have any behringers so I got an Ace patch bay, it was about the same price and looked decent to me, I will check out that link though
LokiCone PokerMember
Since: Apr 07, 2002
Feb 23, 2004 11:30 pm Okey, correct me if I'm wrong, but essentially I would connect everything to the back of the patchbay and then use the front to connect things to each other? Like say I had a desk with direct outs and insert points, a reverb unit, a vocoder, and a compressor, and my delta ins and outs all hooked up to the back of the patch bay. I could then patch it on the front to have a direct out from the desk going to the reverb unit, another direct out going straight into the delta, another direct out going to the vocoder, an insert point going to the compressor, and then the main outs of the desk going to the delta, and the delta outs going to my amp and speakers... all by wiring things on the front panel?
Feb 24, 2004 12:02 am that's how i understand it
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Feb 24, 2004 07:42 pm Yes indeed that is correct.
Loki, Hosa also makes 8 channel snakes in various lengths. They are pretty moderately priced and you can find them used some times. I scored a 20' one at Music Go Round for $18.00 last year and have picked up several others for under $30.00. That is what I use to get to my synths and the patch bays from my desk and such. They also interconnect my two racks of gear.
Feb 26, 2004 05:01 pm Loki... It all depends on if you have the patchbay channels set up in "Normaled" or "De-Nomaled" operation. In Normaled operation you can you it for insert points on your board. You plug your "in" and "out" in the back and the signal flows through. Then from the front pannel of the patchbay you can go out into a compressor, or whatever. The signal path on the back is not broken at this point. But, you do have the output signal present at the input signal of the compressor. Then you can adjust the gain of the copressor so it's not totally peaking out. Then once you come out of the compressor and back into the front input of the patchbay the back signal path is broken and the signal will run through the copressor.
To hook something like a compressor up you have to "de-noraml the patchbay channel. You take the channel out and flip it 180 degrees so that the front top becomes the back bottom. Now you plug the in and out of the copressor into the back and you can just patch it from the front pannel. The back top will be parallel to the front top of the same channel.... and the bottom back with the bottom front. It should all be coverd in your manual.... although it can be a bit confusing at first.
Feb 27, 2004 12:20 am Quote:
although it can be a bit confusing at first.
phew! no kidding. i read that twice and i still can't make sense of it!
been meaning to look into this "normaled/denormaled" business for awhile but can't make heads nor tails of it
Feb 27, 2004 10:25 am Jamie... I'll simplify it when I have more time. It's a little harder to explain than I thought it would be.
WaltChief Cook and Bottle WasherMember
Since: May 10, 2002
Feb 27, 2004 11:17 pm I went a little different route with my patch bay. I plugged every unit that I use as an insert into the back of the patch bay. Inputs to the unit on bottom, outputs on top per convention. Then I custom wired the patch bay circuit boards so that only the bottom connection of each patch carries signal. This front connection is wired as a bidirectional TRS connection so I can use a standard TRS cable from the front of the patch bay to the insert of my mixer. I guess I kinda reversed the topography of a standard studio making the conditioning units the center of the universe instead of the mixer. Kinda wierd but it works well for recording on the road. The only smafu that I have not yet conquered is my DI rack. I can't run it through the patch bay without inducing hum. Obviously a grounding problem I havn't figgured out yet.
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Feb 27, 2004 11:26 pm My Behringer patch bays can do that all by themselves with the flip of a switch. And yes the are TRS compliant.
WaltChief Cook and Bottle WasherMember
Since: May 10, 2002
Feb 27, 2004 11:52 pm Noise,
I remember you mentioning that. Unfortunately I had already picked up an A.P. Or to be more exact a friend had for me. Wish I could figure out the DI thing. It is a PIA plugging instruments into the back of the rack.
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Mar 01, 2004 03:52 pm Ya, I know I was skeptical when I bought the Behringers as I woundered how they could make it that simple since I was used to doing as you did and hardwiring it all. So I tried one and it was all they said and more. So I went out and bought several more. I think I even picked one up for dB as well. Now I use them in all the installations I do. They are deffinately the bomb. If ya need to make a change on a channel you simply slide that thing out about 2 or 3 inches and the switches are right there easy to get at and change.
Mar 01, 2004 05:05 pm Switches... wow that would be nice. I have to flip mine. What are they Noize just little dip switches?
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Mar 01, 2004 09:25 pm Yep, not real little but dip switches non the less. You can assing each of 24 sets individually to either Parallel, Half-Normaled, Normalled, or open. And in the open postion it is like having a 48 point patch bay. It is one rock solid unit. It is twice as heavy as any of the others I have owned and seems to have lasted twice as long as well. The reason I went with them was I had fried out two high end patch basy from pulling and moving plugs all the time. I havent had that happen with these yet.
WaltChief Cook and Bottle WasherMember
Since: May 10, 2002
Mar 01, 2004 09:30 pm Ya Noise, that is sweet! In a way it makes sense however; The technical writer for my Behringer board did quite the little "skit" on how stupid inserts are wired, but for compatability with other equipment Behringer followed suit. So they offer resolve to the known stupididy with their patch bays. The MX9 also quite the little expose on patch bays in the manual. Kinda all makes sense. Geee, I just like that company!
Karetaker, not to butt in, but (notice double but't indicating I doodid it anyway) The behringer not only provides normalized and non-normalized but split tip and ring as well for insert cable conversion.
Mar 02, 2004 11:47 am Don't be shy about butting in Walt. I'm going to have to look into one of those. It sounds a lot more flexible than my DBX or Furman. At least with the Furman you don't have to take it out of the rack to change it. But, you still have to do the old flipparroo.
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Mar 03, 2004 10:24 pm Ya, I had a Furman as well and hated having to flip em. But it still didnt give all the choices the Behringer does.
And Walt, good point on the Behringer manuals, they really do go the extra mile in order to make sure the user understands how and why the gear works as it does. And yes indeed, I like them as well.
