First Song posts here
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flame...bringing sexy backMember
Since: Jul 01, 2002
Apr 28, 2003 04:47 am just had a listen...cool!
blue sunrise is cool...like the basslines, the brooding keys at the start, and the guitar is absolutely brilliant. the key change at about 1.00 is unexpected (for me at least) and gives a nice twist to the sound. i thought the piano that comes in after that sounded a little artificial...although im only listening to the lofi stream of the song, so that might not help! all in...it managed to keep my attention for the full four inutes ish...which surprised me - im not big on instrumentals normally. all in, very cool!
Profound is very cool...like the synth noises at the start, first little bit before the guitars kicked in reminded me of john squire, and then the chorus reminded me of something seventies mixed with a bit of grunge. interesting chord sequence in the choruses....which again helped keep my interest. like the solo - very cool twiddly bits especially.
from first listens i cant fault the sound or the ixes really...im sure if i listened harder for something i'd find it, but the tunes are good enough that id listen to them as a whole rather than listening to individual parts looking for faults.
good work dude...did ya record all the bits yourself or are ya only one part of the puzzle? id love to do something with your guitarist especially...and the bassist and drummer come to think of it!
Apr 28, 2003 06:31 pm Hello Flame,
I am the guitarist and I did all the recording and mixing... My wife did piano and played bass and did drum programing.
Thanks for the comments about the guitar solos!
If you can listen to the sounds and mixes harder.. I'm not really happy with some of the drum sounds and would like some helpful feedback
Thanks again
Shred
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Apr 28, 2003 09:52 pm Hey shred, I see you are from just south of the cities. I was at the JS show at the Medina Ballroom also. I am from just a bit less south of the cities then you are. I will give the tunes a little better listen tommorrow and give ya some feedback. I did give em a quick listen and was very impressed. I will say you can really here the JS influence in blue sunrise for sure, and I liked profound as well but have to admit that I do like instrumentals that are guitar driven like that.
Peace
WaltChief Cook and Bottle WasherMember
Since: May 10, 2002
Apr 29, 2003 11:00 am Shredfit,
First things first. The musicianship is OUTSTANDING! One one hand I am jelous of having a keyboard player of that calaber "in house" as it where. On the other hand I can't imagine two musicians surviving in the same household. LOL
I am going to have to put you off until tonight too however. I am on a laptop and need to get your stuff into the studio puter to give a good listen for the recording sonics.
I truely hope you (plural) will hang out here for a while. I am very taken by the musicianship and would like to hear more.
Be back to you this evening!
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Apr 29, 2003 10:09 pm OK shred, I have listened several times now to blue sunrise. I love the composition, and your playing fits in nicely. From your post above, you state you are unhappy with the drum sounds. Is it all the drum sounds or just one in particular? If I may make a suggestion, I would try bringing the tail of the reverb down just a bit. I believe it is the snare in certain parts of the tune that seems to ring out just a bit too much. And that in turn is stepping on the guitar just a bit. I guess the first thing to try would be just bringing the entire drum mix down a bit and see how that sounds. You might also try cutting the EQ a bit on the snare itself just to back it out a bit, and that in turn would not combat the guitar part. You might also try just replacing that snare sample with something with a little more bottom end on it, that might also help. I do like the sound of the snare itself, it has a really wide open crack with the reverb you have on it, but it does step on the guitar in certain parts. You could also try backing down the snares velocity and that also would help clear the way for the guitar to come through clearly. If I may ask, what are you using for the drum sounds, maybe I might have a suggestion or sample that might fit a bit better?
Over all you seem to have pretty good mix going. If I may ask also, can you tell me esactly were you have the instruments panned to in the mix? Spreading them out a bit might help a bit to make things a bit clearer also. But as I said it is a pretty good sounding mix although mp3 tend to make it a bit harder to determine exactly how it sounds at CD quality level.
I will give profound a better listen tommorrw and let you know on that also.
Peace
Apr 29, 2003 11:13 pm Thanks for the kind words Walt...
Noize, I will look into the reverb on the snare. To be honest I didn't notice that. The drum sound come from 2 ensoniq SD-1 keyboards. What we did was midi them together and then I get 8 analog outs from them... These outs are panned so I get drum isolation per track (ie Kick, snare, toms, hi-hat etc) all on seperate tracks
I realize others don't work this way via midi...but it just seem to make more sense to me.
I use Pro Tools LE and do not have sound replacer to I don't know really how to change the sample(i'm green at this)
The panning is as follows (going on memory here) toms spread 40%, L/R Kick/Bass gtr middle,
snare middle w/reverb tail 20% L, Guitar 20% R w/ reverb tail 20% left... Keyboard 20% L with reverb tail 20% R... with various parts panned more or less with automation.
I have no idea if anyone does it this way... I'm just kind of learning as I go.
My biggest gripe about the drum sounds are the cymbals... I've worked hard eq wise to get them to sound (at best OK)
The CD quality sound is a lot less squashed sounding to me... the mp3's sound like I got a little happy with a limiter on the 2 track bounce.
Thanks for your listen and I'll look at your suggestions with my next mix fix. <---- he he
Shred
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Apr 29, 2003 11:20 pm Sounds like youwnet about getting the drums into PT the right way though, that is how I usually do mine, seperate tracks. It make it easier to fix things when they dont fit. I will take another listen tommorrow now that I know your approximate pan settings and maybe it will give me a better picture of what is goind on.
Peace
WaltChief Cook and Bottle WasherMember
Since: May 10, 2002
Apr 30, 2003 01:15 am Ok, got a good listen. I am not trusting my ears on this one. I am just learning too. Usually I find my ears agree with Noise and he is a lot more experienced than I. What I heard was mudding between the kick and the bass. I would like to hear a little more compression and a little tighter atack on the bass, and the kick moved away from the bass. A little more space between bass notes. I like the smoothness of the sustain but the character of the bass is getting lost in the mix. The drum programming by the way is sweet! Nice job better half! Now the sound used for the snare would have a little more "crack" for my minds ear. Actually pulling it away from the low mid range. With bass, keys and guitar living in that region largely I think the snare could stand out a little more that way. Please take into consideration I am a fool for boom clack! Cymbles are something I can't help with much. I hear them and they sound fine to me, but I am an old person and that section of the frequency range is unreliable for me.
Don't ya just love it! Which way do I go!
Please post the changes if you decided to re-work the piece. I would love to follow this one. It is so clean a well done that it would be a great learning experience for me! Sorry being selfish. But more important keep on keepin on. You two will do great stuff!
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Apr 30, 2003 04:15 pm Walt, I think we got it here. What you miss, I hear, and what I miss you hear. that means between us we have one good set of ears.
Shred, did you have any verb on the cymbals? I am going to listen a bit more tonight, and also listen to profound as well.
May 01, 2003 02:08 am Walt
Here Is what I did for the kick and bass. I gave the Bass a slight eq boost in the lo-mid area around 240hz... (I read in Recording Mag. that a jazz bass player eq's his bass in this way for more punch)... This of course, is the opposite of what I do when we play live. Then I Cut an eq hole around the same freq. for the kick drum...
Perhaps what you hear is that I should boost and cut more drastically. This may help them sit better in the mix... I'll give it a try and post the results.
Noize2u,
Yes I do have a very little reverb on the cymbals which I pan (reverb tail) to the center... I've tried different reverb tail pannings and if I don't pan to the center it sounds very unrealitic to me...
Thanks for the feedback guys
Shred
WaltChief Cook and Bottle WasherMember
Since: May 10, 2002
May 01, 2003 11:34 am Sounds like a plan Shred! Love to hear it!
My approach is a little different and definately a matter of taste. I use a minds eye image of how I would set up for a performance. For example: When I record a drum kit with seperate mics I will assemble those tracks maybe 20 points right of center in a close group. Kick at 20, tom one 22, tom two 23... you can see where I am going. Bass maybe out to 40 right. Guitar 30 left. This is just another way to keep things from fighting. And you are right about eq's being different on a recorded piece from a performed piece. The macro sound chamber of a performance theater and the amps used etc. are a far cry from music eminating from stereo speakers in a living room. As a bassist I set up very differently when recording than I do performing. But I must say as well that recording has really assisted me in my performance as well. I worked for five years trying to emulate an upright bass sound with a bass getfiddle. Then when I started recording the beast, I started hearing more than I have ever heard before. The best I can relate it is that I started listening during performance with a more educated ear. In fact my director took time during rehersal just last night to inform me that " I don't know what you do with that amp or that thing, but I have never heard a bass guitar sound so much like an upright". I know that little blurb is tangential, but IMHO it demonstrates the open mindedness that needs to be present to get good recordings. Believe what you hear and change what you do untill you hear what you want to hear. You won't be sorry.
