I'm stupid and need help

> > > I'm stupid and need help

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Cone Poker
Member Since: Apr 07, 2002

Need help with a temporary set up.

Until I get my monitors in I am using my cheesey computer speakers. What I wanted to do was hook my mixer up to my delta 44, and in Sonar selct the 44 as the input and use the stock soundcard as the output because that is the one going to the speakers, but when I did this and tried to play into sonar it had no sound and I don't think it was even getting any input. Odd...

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Czar of Midi
Administrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002

Dec 30, 2004 11:55 pm

Loki, when you bring up the Delta control panel do you see anything on the meters?

Another issue is the stock sound card may not play nice with the Delta, and that may be causing the issue. It is a matter of the audio clocks not working together, which is common when using 2 differant sound cards from differant manufacturer's.

Cone Poker
Member
Since: Apr 07, 2002

Dec 31, 2004 03:09 am

yeah the control panel shows the activity and the sound is going out of the gear into my mixer (the leds flash on the mixer) and out of the mixer into the delta (the control panel shows this) but when in sonar I see no activity at all, even though I know the signal chain is good, and I hear no output

Guess I'll just wait the week or two to get some proper monitors and bypass the stock card altogether

Czar of Midi
Administrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002

Dec 31, 2004 12:59 pm

OK, did you select the cards driver to be active in Sonar? Second, did you select the card as the output for that specific channel in the main view of Sonar? Just thinking out loud.

Cone Poker
Member
Since: Apr 07, 2002

Dec 31, 2004 05:28 pm

alright well the monitors came sooner than I thought, so I got em today. yay. Now heres the issue. My synth is hooked up using a y cable to channel one on my mixer. So Left and Right outputs are both going into channel one. This is the only thing I have plugged into my mixer. My mixer is going to the delta 44, and the outs of the delta 44 are going to my monitors. I can play back audio fine through the monitors, and when I play the keyboard without sonar running I can hear the sound through the monitors, but only on the right one. When I looked at the Delta Control panel only the right side was seeing any activity on the ins and outs, and in sonar it still sees no activity at all, neither recording or playing back any.

Cone Poker
Member
Since: Apr 07, 2002

Dec 31, 2004 05:39 pm

Playing a stero song through winamp with the delta selected as the primary sound driver does show activity on both the left and right, and I can hear the sound from both monitors.

I don't understand what's going on at all.

But I do know frontline assembly sounds awesome through these M-Audios

Administrator
Since: Apr 03, 2002

Dec 31, 2004 06:01 pm

Ok, first thing to check is your y cable, it sounds like one side is bad somewhere down the chain...

Cone Poker
Member
Since: Apr 07, 2002

Dec 31, 2004 07:41 pm

Alright I narrowed this down to a cable problem, but Have found another problem. I'm getting some bad latency, for example when I talk into the mic it takes nearly two seconds for it to come out the speakers.

Cone Poker
Member
Since: Apr 07, 2002

Dec 31, 2004 07:42 pm

And there is an echo. On playback there is no latency or echo though

Excuse Me, I Like 2 Ask Question
Member
Since: Dec 05, 2004

Jan 01, 2005 11:32 am

That sounds like a problem with the soundcard/delta ... check the settings...

Cone Poker
Member
Since: Apr 07, 2002

Jan 01, 2005 04:28 pm

what should I be looking for?

Cone Poker
Member
Since: Apr 07, 2002

Jan 01, 2005 04:36 pm

Ok if I switch HW out to HW in 1/2 when recording I have no echo or latency, but I don't hear anything in playback...

Administrator
Since: Apr 03, 2002

Jan 01, 2005 04:37 pm

monitor mixer always worked best for me...

Cone Poker
Member
Since: Apr 07, 2002

Jan 01, 2005 04:44 pm

yeah but with monitor mixer enabled I get the echo and latency problem.

Czar of Midi
Administrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002

Jan 01, 2005 06:49 pm

Loki, for the keyboard thing you will need to either just run one cable from the left output of the keyboard or run 2 cables to 2 channels in the board. Your mixer channel inputs are not stereo so it will of course only see the tip and sleeve of the y cable, which is going to give you only one side.

As for the latency, how fast is your PC? I thought that e-machine was pretty new so it should be OK. And the Delta 44 you will want to make sure you have the latest drivers installed. I am running the 48 which is just the last 2 numbers of the full version. But I am getting down to 5.8ms on my old PIII 667 with 768 meg of ram. So I am guessing it might not be profiling the card or it is older driver version. Also you might try ASIO if your running Sonar 2.0 or newer. Also go to the Delta control panel and in the Hardware settings tab make sure you have the latency buffer set down to at least 256, if you can get by eith 128 try it but it may induce noise when you start stacking up tracks and synths.

Cone Poker
Member
Since: Apr 07, 2002

Jan 01, 2005 07:45 pm

Alright, plugged the keyboard up propery and got that sussed out.

My PC is pretty fast, as it is pretty new. I just downloaded and installed the latest drivers. In the delta control panel latency is set for 256. When sonar is not open everything acts fine, there is no echo or latency. When I open sonar is when the problems come in, so maybe it's a setting in sonar someplace? Also, I just recorded me saying stuff into the mic and it plays back a faint echo also.

Czar of Midi
Administrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002

Jan 01, 2005 07:55 pm

You might have a loop happening somewhere from the mixer to the Delta then. Make sure whatever is coming ouot of your mixer to the moniters is not inadvertantly getting back to the Delta.

For the latency issue, I moniter straight outa Sonar without the Delta moniter mixer on and get the latency I stated above. I am wondering if it might be an issue as I said earlier of the Delta not playing nice with the other sound card. That can cause a bit of a tough problem to solve there as well.

Cone Poker
Member
Since: Apr 07, 2002

Jan 01, 2005 08:40 pm

yeah that would indeed suck as the stock soundcard is built into the board...

As far as loops go, the signal chain is Mic and Synth into Mixer, Main left and Right outputs into Delta ins, Delta Outs to Monitors, so I don't see anywhere where a feedback loop would occur

Cone Poker
Member
Since: Apr 07, 2002

Jan 01, 2005 09:45 pm

Just going to try and reinstall sonar

Cone Poker
Member
Since: Apr 07, 2002

Jan 01, 2005 09:55 pm

and that didn't work. Arg this is so frustrating

Czar of Midi
Administrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002

Jan 01, 2005 10:03 pm

Check and make absolutely certain that the onboard sound card is not selected and that its not set in the Windows recording preferances to the what you hear setting.

But ya, it sounds like you got the stuff set up right so far.

Cone Poker
Member
Since: Apr 07, 2002

Jan 01, 2005 10:12 pm

I went to the control panel and made sure the default recording and playback cards were the delta. Still getting the problem. I don't think it's a compatability issue though, as I'm pretty sure I've used sonar and the delta on this computer before without any problems.

Excuse Me, I Like 2 Ask Question
Member
Since: Dec 05, 2004

Jan 01, 2005 10:35 pm

one last suggestion, but not sure, wait til dB,noize, or anyone else reads this..and agree's with me..cuz i could be wrong...


I know on CEP theres RECORD DEVICE SETTING it allows me to pick between wave mapper, m-audio mobile pre, ac97...

I'm sure in sonar, it has a similar setting, make sure you have DELTA as you recording, if not try wave mapper...

im not sure were you'll find this in the program tho..

Try OPTIONS/SETTINGS and click DEVICE ORDER...

Czar of Midi
Administrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002

Jan 02, 2005 02:05 pm

Loki, when I get home from some errands I will open Sonar and see if there are any defaults that would cause this.

Czar of Midi
Administrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002

Jan 02, 2005 03:02 pm

Loki, which versionof Sonar are you using? I still have most of them installed on the old box, and the Delta is on that box as well so that might help.

Cone Poker
Member
Since: Apr 07, 2002

Jan 02, 2005 09:36 pm

2.0

Czar of Midi
Administrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002

Jan 02, 2005 10:40 pm

Go to options/audio then choose the input monitering tab and make sure nothing is selected in there as well. I know Sonar defaults to using input monitering so it may be selected in there even if you have it turned off in the Delta panel.

Cone Poker
Member
Since: Apr 07, 2002

Jan 03, 2005 01:39 am

Alright so problem one has been solved by disabling the input monitoring, thanks noize. Probel two came up though. With the monitor mixer selected in the Delta Control Panel I can record fine, but there is no playback. If I change to HW out it will playback though.

Czar of Midi
Administrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002

Jan 03, 2005 10:40 pm

Loki, this is how my panel is set up for the Delta. In the Patchbay/Router tab set it up like this.

H/W Out 1/2__________*H/W Out 3/4
*WavOut 1/2__________*WavOut 3/4

I dont have any problem with latency, and can hear what I am playing while I record and can hear my playback tracks as well. I am using ASIO so in the Hardware Settings tab of the Delta panel I also check the box in the Asio options to disable audio app use of moniter mixer and patchbay/router.

Cone Poker
Member
Since: Apr 07, 2002

Jan 04, 2005 03:04 am

When I have HW out 1/2 selected instead of minotor mix I don't hear anything though, The signal is going into the mixer, out of that and into the delta and it shows that it is going out, but I don't hear anything

Czar of Midi
Administrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002

Jan 04, 2005 04:01 pm

Loki, in the tab you will see the upper letters for H/W Out 1/2 in blue. Under them should be a selection for WavOut 1/2. Click the button that will select that option and it should all be good. This will direct the stream of audio directly to the hardware outputs 1/2.

What it is doing is routing the audio from Sonar or what ever app right to the hardware outputs on the delta. So dont go down to the buttons that read H/W In 1/2 because that wont do it.

Cone Poker
Member
Since: Apr 07, 2002

Jan 04, 2005 06:59 pm

yeah thats what I'm saying, with that selected I don't hear anything at all that is going into the delta, even though it shows that it is.

Czar of Midi
Administrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002

Jan 04, 2005 09:09 pm

OK then, lets back track a bit. I am sure you have covered this but lets check.

In the track you want to record to you have the delta input 1 or 2 selected as you input source.

In the same track you have the out selcetion and that should be delta 1/2. It might might come up as analog out 1/2.

Are you actually getting a wav to show up in the track in Sonar? I think you said you were. If so you should then be able to hear it as long as you have the delta output selected in that track.

Cone Poker
Member
Since: Apr 07, 2002

Jan 04, 2005 10:20 pm

Okey, for some reason unbeknownst to me everything is working fine and dandy now, with no evidence of any problems. All I did was open sonar and go "well lets see if I can suss this out" and everything worked perfectly. Gah!

Thanks for all the help though Noize, and the rest of ya

Czar of Midi
Administrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002

Jan 04, 2005 11:00 pm

Ah, the setting may not have taken effect untill after a restart. Glad it is goin now though.

Cone Poker
Member
Since: Apr 07, 2002

Jan 04, 2005 11:12 pm

yeah me too, I was going insane

> > > I'm stupid and need help

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