need help with signal routing

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Member Since: Oct 27, 2003

ok... im still a complete newbie! i bought a behringer ub1002 mixer as suggested by others on the board...

now i need some help with how to connect it up to my soundcard! i have connected the "tape out" RCAs to the line in of my soundcard and thats great im getting a signal and its all nice...

but my question is, how do i route the signal back into my mixer so that i can monitor the recorded signal and the one i am playing at the same time... does that make sense? hope someone can help me....

cheers

ozgeorge

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Contributor
Since: Sep 09, 2002


Nov 12, 2003 03:34 am

i have a similar mixer, the MX802a, and I have my main outs of my mixer going into my soundcard ins, and and soundcard outs going into my mixer's tape ins. There's some buttons in teh mixer that control how the tape signal gets routed allowing me to send the tape ins to either the main mix or just the control room and headphones or both. With these buttons (and the mutes on my soundcard ins) i never have to unplug any of it. Well, almost never.

Member
Since: Oct 27, 2003


Nov 12, 2003 04:10 am

if you sent your tape ins to the main mix, wouldnt you get an infinite loop with the signal from the soundcard coming into the mixer and then going back to the soundcard?

sorry i dont really understand any of this

Member
Since: Jan 08, 2003


Nov 12, 2003 11:37 am

Not if the routing on the board is set up properly.

Read your manual.

W.

Cone Poker
Member
Since: Apr 07, 2002


Nov 12, 2003 01:13 pm

helpful waldo..

What you can aslo do is to use seperate busses on your board. For example if you have a 4 bus console you can run your instruments to all but two channels, and assign those channels to bus one and two, and then run the outs of your soundcard into the remaining to channels on the board, and have those channels going to the last two busses which then go to your amp and speakers. At least I think this can be done.

Bane of All Existence
Member
Since: Mar 27, 2003


Nov 12, 2003 07:39 pm

oz-

whether the signal coming to your RCA tape ins is present in your signal is controlled by the buttons "2TK TO CTRL ROOM" and "2TK TO MIX". with your setup, there is almost no reason to ever use the 2TK TO MIX button, and that is the one that would give you an infinite loop and feedback pretty heavily, depending on where your "MAIN MIX" knob is set.

using the 2TK TO CTRL ROOM is how you use those tape ins to monitor what you have recorded before while tracking.

but yeah, read your manual:
www.behringer-download.de...1_ENG_Rev_C.pdf

a.k.a. Porp & Mr. Muffins
Member
Since: Oct 09, 2002


Nov 12, 2003 07:50 pm

Exactly. You want to route the tape inputs to the Headphones/Control Room bus which is controlled by the headphone volume knob and goes out to both the control room and headphone outputs. You can have your speakers hooked up to the conrol room outs and your headphones hooked to the headphone out. You'll want to make sure that the tapes ins aren't set to go to the main mix as well, or you will get that feedback loop you spoke of.

Hey-- I remember when I explained this to Jamie and a few other folks way back when... He has remembered well ;) I spent days figuring that out a few years ago. I was so proud of myself when I came up with the ol' tape ins system :D

a.k.a. Porp & Mr. Muffins
Member
Since: Oct 09, 2002


Nov 12, 2003 08:07 pm

Oh yes-- and make sure that only the tape ins are set to go to the control room/headphone bus, you don't want the main mix going there too (Most of the time) because then you'll be playing back the same thing over itself when recording, depending on how your soundcard is set up.

Member
Since: Oct 27, 2003


Nov 12, 2003 09:41 pm

jeez! you guys are great!

so this is infact the setup i already had i think:

RCA from tape out to sound card in
sound card out to RCA "tape in"

then using the tape to control room button to listen to the recorded tracks as i lay down new ones...

i dont think this little mixer has busses to use the other method... or at least i cant see a way of assigning tracks to different outs...

i do have yet another question tho! when im listening to "the control room" through the phones, i am hearing whatever im playing through say track one BEFORE it goes off through the loop and back through the tape ins yeah?

also, is there anyway of dropping the volume of the monitored stuff coming through the tape in so that i can hear myself playing a bit clearer over the top? i have been using the track one level control to boost me above the monitor, but that stuffs up my carefully set levels....

cheers!
(i love you guys)

ozgeorge

ps, i did read the manual, cover to cover, for a mixer this price you dont get tomes of documentation.

Member
Since: Jan 08, 2003


Nov 12, 2003 11:57 pm

Quote:
i do have yet another question tho! when im listening to "the control room" through the phones, i am hearing whatever im playing through say track one BEFORE it goes off through the loop and back through the tape ins yeah?
Control room is the phones, what you hear will depend on how you route it. The basic routing is described on page 7. I don't see any other routing options in the manual. To me, it looks like the only option is to turn on/off efx to the phones, so it's basically parrallel to the mains, just prior to the efx mix.

Quote:
also, is there anyway of dropping the volume of the monitored stuff coming through the tape in so that i can hear myself playing a bit clearer over the top?

If you route the tape in through the mains, then your mains/control room will control the volume. Switch is listed on page 7 with pics. If it's too loud, turn yourself up, or turn your source (output from your sound card) down.

W.

Bane of All Existence
Member
Since: Mar 27, 2003


Nov 13, 2003 01:06 am

sorry waldo, gotta disagree. if you route the soundcard feed in through the mains (one of the stereo channels), then that mix will go out the main outputs along with the track. that especially isn't cool with stuff like click tracks in the playback. you could route the tracks out through the auxiliaries instead, but that seems out of scope for a newbie. it might be the only option though if his mixer software isn't that comprehensive.

control room and the headphone mix are the exact same thing. their volume is controlled by the same knob. when you press the 2TK TO CTRL ROOM button, all you are doing is listening to your feed from your soundcard. you are not hearing whatever tracks you are playing, since those are part of the MAIN MIX (which is not present in the headphones or CTRL ROOM outputs when that 2TK button is pressed).

to get your soundcard to give you a balanced feed of the input and the tracks being played back: since you're using a normal soundcard, you need to go to your mixer settings (if you're using a PC, it might be the yellow speaker icon in the tray at the bottom right) and make sure that your LINE IN channel is both not muted AND is at an appropriate volume compared to your WAVE OUT channel. it's tough to know your exact setup, so be creative and experiment. if your LINE IN and WAVE OUT channels aren't appearing in the mixer, go to Options>Properties and make sure that their boxes are checked. if they don't exist at all, then may god have mercy on your soul! :-)


Member
Since: Jan 08, 2003


Nov 13, 2003 01:22 am

Sorry, missed the '/' in the first part of the sentance, but got it on the second. By mains, I meant monitor mains/control room.

W.

Member
Since: Jan 08, 2003


Nov 13, 2003 01:28 am

Although, you could do it the way I mentioned (mistakingly), simply by making sure you aren't routing your sound cards line input directly to the output (through your media control panel). This will ensure only what is being played by the soundcard routes out to the board, and your mixer will take care of the live stuff (as it's mixed in with the tape input when the tape->mix switch is on), and eliminate any redundant loop. You will find, however, that what's being played, will appear in your main mix (back into the recording), so it's really only useful if you are doing 2 track recording only (not multi-track) as it acts to 'mix down' and together the in and output. This is used in tape recording, when only a 2 track tape is available, quite a bit.

This can be done by double clicking on your little speaker in the right hand corner of your screen, and muting 'Line In'.

W.

Bane of All Existence
Member
Since: Mar 27, 2003


Nov 13, 2003 10:07 am

with all due respect, i'm not sure that you are familiar with how these small behringer boards work. if you mute the LINE IN on your media control panel, then the live signal that is coming from the board (what is currently being tracked as opposed to playback) is gone entirely when the 2TK TO CTRL ROOM button is being pressed. this causes serious problems when you are doing vocals or direct bass/guitars.

using the 2TK TO MIX button would only serve to make sure that the playback is re-routed into the soundcard. this setup has the playback bleeding onto what is currently being tracked, and it's very undesirable (once again, especially for things like click tracks). you also get some mega feedback going on if you have the MAIN MIX knob past 10 o'clock. i learned that the hard way.

since the RCA TAPE INs are direct feeds from the soundcard, it is required that the mix coming into them is a balance of the tracks already recorded (playback) and the tracks currently being laid down. you NEED this when tracking vocals and direct instruments. you know, it's the (i need more of me, less of the other instruments) phenomenon being mixed in the computer's mixer control panel. when the 2TK TO CTRL ROOM button is depressed, the active mix in the headphones and CTRL ROOM outputs (which go to monitors) is what is coming in on these TAPE INs.

the TAPE OUTs and the MAIN OUTs have the same mix present in each other at all times. the volume for both is controlled by the MAIN MIX knob. the TAPE OUTs are hotter.

a.k.a. Porp & Mr. Muffins
Member
Since: Oct 09, 2002


Nov 13, 2003 11:01 am

Okay, I'm looking at a full size image of the mixer... let's start over again to keep things clear.

Make sure the button that says "TAPE TO CTRL ROOM" is pushed down. "TAPE TO MIX" should be left up, as well as "FX TO CTRL ROOM." "PHANTOM" should be pushed down if you're using condenser microphones with the mixer. Otherwise, it should be left up as well.

Plug the outputs of the "MAIN OUT" section into your soundcard's line input(s). (You will need a splitter cable if you don't have one and your sound card only has a single, stereo line input) Bring up the "MAIN MIX" slider on the mixer to "0"

Plug the outputs of your soundcard into the "TAPE IN" red and white inputs on the mixer, making sure that you've got the "L" and "R" inputs matching the correct output(s) of your card. (Again, you may need a splitter cable if you don't already have one).

Plug your monitors or speakers into the "CTRL ROOM OUT" outputs on the mixer, and plug your headphones into the "PHONES" output of the mixer.
You can now use the "PHONES/CONTROL ROOM" knob to affect the volume of both your speakers and headphones.

[quote]RCA from tape out to sound card in
sound card out to RCA "tape in"[/quote]

Yes, you could do it that way, or you could just use the main outs on your mixer rather than the tape outs to get the signal to the sound card. Either way it's the same. I would recommend using the main mix outputs.

Quote:
then using the tape to control room button to listen to the recorded tracks as i lay down new ones...


Yeah, just leave the tape to control room button down all the time. That's all you want going to the control room.

Quote:
i dont think this little mixer has busses to use the other method... or at least i cant see a way of assigning tracks to different outs...


By a bus, I was referring to the control room/headphones. That is a bus, and the Main Outs are also buses as well. When you're recording, you can specify which bus (L or R) you want to go to by moving the pan knob back and forth on the mixer channel.

Quote:
i do have yet another question tho! when im listening to "the control room" through the phones, i am hearing whatever im playing through say track one BEFORE it goes off through the loop and back through the tape ins yeah?


Now here's the question. I was expecting that your mixer would have a "MIX TO CTRL ROOM" button like mine. So, I guess that this means the Main Mix is always going to the control room. This is not ideal in my opinion, but it will work.

What you have to do is set your sound card settings/mixer so that it is not sending back the signal that it is recieving while it is recieving it. So the inputs need to be muted. This way you'll be monitoring the signal you're recording through your mixer before it goes to the sound card, and monitoring the tracks you've already recorded through the sound card and out your mixer.

Quote:
also, is there anyway of dropping the volume of the monitored stuff coming through the tape in so that i can hear myself playing a bit clearer over the top? i have been using the track one level control to boost me above the monitor, but that stuffs up my carefully set levels....


All you have to do is open up your soundcard's mixer on your computer and bring down the output level there. That should fix the relative balance, since you're monitoring the signal your recording simply through the mixer without it going through the soundcard too.


I hope this helps! It really is pretty confusing and you just have to sit down and try stuff. That way you understand your whole setup better, and you become a better engineer in the process :)

Good Luck,
-Porp

Member
Since: Jan 08, 2003


Nov 13, 2003 02:42 pm

Quote:
if you mute the LINE IN on your media control panel, then the live signal that is coming from the board (what is currently being tracked as opposed to playback) is gone entirely
No, it's not, since it still exists at the board (which is where you are monitoring from), and it still exists on the recording panel. By having the T2K to MIX button on, that means it is mixed with the rest of the busses, and out to your monitors. By having the T2K to CONTROL ROOM button on, that means it will mix into your phones/control room, and not the main mix.

The method I described eliminates the feedback you mention, as the soundcard does not mix it's input with it's output.

Quote:
since the RCA TAPE INs are direct feeds from the soundcard, it is required that the mix coming into them is a balance of the tracks already recorded (playback) and the tracks currently being laid down.

Once again, the mix 'coming into them' is sourced at the board, your monitors are plugged into the board, and your board mixes the Tape ins with the rest. A tape in is simply another input channel (unbalanced, consumer grade) on the board.

Quote:
The TAPE OUTs and the MAIN OUTs have the same mix present in each other at all times. the volume for both is controlled by the MAIN MIX knob. the TAPE OUTs are hotter

Actually, they are not, the tape outs are consumer grade impedence and output, unbalanced, where as the mains are usually +4dBu. The only difference is that tape-outs are usually static 'unity' gain.

W.

Member
Since: Jan 08, 2003


Nov 13, 2003 02:48 pm

Let's put it this way, there is hundreds of ways to achieve the same results, even with a small mixer as this.

There is no 'right' way out of those (there is wrong ways that can cause damage, etc.), only better ways to do things, depending on the situaion. No good engineer hard-wires everything, and keeps it that way for life.

W.

a.k.a. Porp & Mr. Muffins
Member
Since: Oct 09, 2002


Nov 13, 2003 03:32 pm

[quote]if you mute the LINE IN on your media control panel, then the live signal that is coming from the board (what is currently being tracked as opposed to playback) is gone entirely
No, it's not, since it still exists at the board (which is where you are monitoring from), and it still exists on the recording panel. By having the T2K to MIX button on, that means it is mixed with the rest of the busses, and out to your monitors. By having the T2K to CONTROL ROOM button on, that means it will mix into your phones/control room, and not the main mix.[/quote]

I think that Minkus is assuming that you wouldn't have the Main Mix going to the CTRL ROOM, which is an option on many mixers, but not this one. This mixer automatically sends the Main Mix to the CTRL ROOM, so you do have to mute the Soundcard's line in, as you mentioned, or you'll have the same thing playing back on top of itself while you're recording it.

I don't see why you would possibly ever want the TAPE TO MIX button on either way you do it.

Member
Since: Jan 08, 2003


Nov 13, 2003 04:22 pm

I did mention that in my post as well, and mentioned the reasons why you might use it ;)

I read the manual, and it mentioned T2K to control room, I realize of course that this manual covers a few models, so being that it's not in front of me (the board), I can only suggest what I see.

W.

a.k.a. Porp & Mr. Muffins
Member
Since: Oct 09, 2002


Nov 13, 2003 04:38 pm

There is a T2K to control room button. I'm talking about MAIN MIX to CTRL ROOM, which it doesn't have.

I would try to explain that last thing I said in my post there, but this whole thread has just become too darn confusing! :)

I give up-- too many oppertunities for misunderstanding! Hahaha

Oh well, I would recommend ozgeorge goes by what I said in that really long post before my last one. I know that that system will work. Of course, for all I know that could be exactly what you and Minkus are explaining to him as well. It's really confusing written down on paper (err... the computer)

Member
Since: Jan 08, 2003


Nov 13, 2003 04:53 pm

Lol, I never said there was (a main mix to control button) ;) Yup, I can see where the confusion would be.

From the manual, this board routes the main mix to the control room, no matter what, so with T2K-Control room button, you are mixing both the main mix, and the T2K together, but only on the phones, thus, safely recording only the 'new stuff', eliminating feedback (by turning muting input on the playback side of the sound card control), and hearing the output from the sound card at the same time.

W.

a.k.a. Porp & Mr. Muffins
Member
Since: Oct 09, 2002


Nov 13, 2003 05:13 pm

Exactly! That's what I said... It was just confusing. It's clear on my big post, though.

So with the method you just described, you will also want to mute the line in on your sound card software mixer.

Ah, it appears that we are in agreement ;)

Here's what I said before:

Quote:
i do have yet another question tho! when im listening to "the control room" through the phones, i am hearing whatever im playing through say track one BEFORE it goes off through the loop and back through the tape ins yeah?

Now here's the question. I was expecting that your mixer would have a "MIX TO CTRL ROOM" button like mine. So, I guess that this means the Main Mix is always going to the control room. This is not ideal in my opinion, but it will work.

What you have to do is set your sound card settings/mixer so that it is not sending back the signal that it is recieving while it is recieving it. So the inputs need to be muted. This way you'll be monitoring the signal you're recording through your mixer before it goes to the sound card, and monitoring the tracks you've already recorded through the sound card and out your mixer.


Member
Since: Jan 08, 2003


Nov 13, 2003 06:23 pm

The tape out is 'parrallel' to the mains, and the tape in is basically another channel, mixed depending on how you set your routing.

If it's set to go to mains, then it's mixed in as another channel after the tape out (won't cause a redundant loop).

--edit--

Misread the quote, thought you were asking! Oh the insanity! lol

Yep, we're basically saying the same thing.

W.

Bane of All Existence
Member
Since: Mar 27, 2003


Nov 13, 2003 08:09 pm

oops, when i say 2TK above, i mean TAPE (as in TAPE TO MIX, TAPE TO CTRL ROOM).

Quote:
From the manual, this board routes the main mix to the control room, no matter what...


what page is that information on? i can't find it. when the TAPE TO CTRL ROOM is pressed, the only mix present in the PHONES and CTRL ROOM outputs is that which is coming from the soundcard via the TAPE INs. the main mix still exists and is going out the MAIN OUTs, but it is not present in what you hear coming out of the PHONES and CTRL ROOM outs.

Quote:
What you have to do is set your sound card settings/mixer so that it is not sending back the signal that it is recieving while it is recieving it. So the inputs need to be muted. This way you'll be monitoring the signal you're recording through your mixer before it goes to the sound card, and monitoring the tracks you've already recorded through the sound card and out your mixer.


since that MAIN MIX is muted in the PHONES and CTRL ROOM outputs with the TAPE TO CTRL ROOM depressed, muting the LINE IN channel in the software mixer is going to make it so that what is currently being tracked is nonexistent in either the headphones or the monitors. so the LINE IN needs to be on, and set to taste.

the manual says this:
Quote:
If you are recording a signal via the TAPE OUTPUT and wish to listen to this simultaneously via the TAPE INPUT, do not use the TAPE TO MIX switch. Doing this would create a feedback loop, since the signal would be routed, via the main mix, back to tape via the TAPE OUTPUT. To monitor the TAPE INPUT, use the TAPE TO CTRL ROOM switch to assign the tape signal to the monitor(s) or headphones. This will avoid the tape signal being routed to the TAPE OUTPUT.


so there is ultimately no point in using the TAPE TO MIX button when you are monitoring a source connected to the mixer via the TAPE INs. even if you aren't monitoring your own input from the souncard (you can hear the amp, instrument without a boost from the headphones), the playback is bleeding through into the tracks that are being recorded. the MAIN OUTs and TAPE OUTs both play the same thing (the MAIN MIX). using your method with ozgeorge's setup would cause that feedback loop.

i think you are just assuming that the mixer has more functionality with how it is routed. the only way you can have the TAPE IN mix (soundcard) present in any fashion is via the TAPE TO switches. TAPE TO CTRL ROOM routes it into the PHONES and CTRL ROOM OUTs (CTRL ROOM mix), and the TAPE TO MIX button routes it to the TAPE OUTs and the MAIN OUTs (the MAIN mix).

i am honestly not sure about how hot the TAPE OUTs are, now that you bring that up. i was told on this forum that they were hotter and to use the MAIN OUTs to connect to my audiophile 2496 (RCA inputs), and i thought that i noticed that when i applied that advice, the MAIN MIX knob could be turned higher and still not clip at the soundcard.

i agree that there are many ways to do the same thing. i have just been using these tiny behringer boards and i've made a lot of mistakes on them, and learned a lot. based upon that, i'm describing what seems to be the the most efficient method to wire ozgeorge's given setup. i am describing what seem to be flaws in your reasoning about the functionality of this board, but which may simply be miscommunication. there definitely is a best way to get ozgeorge's wiring set up. reading all this is pretty mind-numbing, isn't it? :-0

...bringing sexy back
Member
Since: Jul 01, 2002


Nov 14, 2003 01:41 am

wow, you guys are lovin the quote feature in this one...

Member
Since: Jan 08, 2003


Nov 14, 2003 02:28 pm

Quote:
when the TAPE TO CTRL ROOM is pressed, the only mix present in the PHONES and CTRL ROOM outputs is that which is coming from the soundcard via the TAPE INs


If that's the case, then yes, it won't work (and it's a very bad configuration for a board!). When I got some time, I'll see if I can find the spot that infered the T2K (tape/2 track) to CTRL mixed it.

Quote function helps cut down confusion when time has elapsed since thoughts were processed ;)

As far as the manual stating feedback issues w/ T2K to MIX, right, but as I explained above, this can be avioided by not passing input through the output (they didn't explain this in the manual..). It won't solve the 'doubling' effect wherein what's being output will be mixed with the input (recorded will have both output and new input mixed). As I explained, it can be used as a 'feature' rather than a side-effect...

W.

a.k.a. Porp & Mr. Muffins
Member
Since: Oct 09, 2002


Nov 14, 2003 03:15 pm

Well, if it's true that when the TAPE TO CTRL ROOM is pressed, the only mix present in the PHONES and CTRL ROOM outputs is that which is coming from the soundcard via the TAPE INs, then I think that's a good thing. either way it will work. If that is the case then you just unmute the line input on your sound card's software mixer and you're good to go. This is how I do it with my Behringer, but my Behringer has the option of doing it either way. If the mix output is still present with the TAPE TO CTRL ROOM button pressed down, than you just mute the line inputs on your software mixer and you're good to go that way. What's all the fuss about, here? You won't get a doubling side-effect if you do it either of those ways.

I have an idea... How about we ask ozgeorge if things are working out for him :) I think we all understand how the board works. It's confusing but it's not THAT confusing. I think we're just misunderstanding each other.

Bane of All Existence
Member
Since: Mar 27, 2003


Nov 14, 2003 03:51 pm

ha ha i see something here. when i'm talking about how using the TAPE TO MIX button will result in a feedback loop from the soundcard, that obviously will not occur if the LINE IN is muted in the software. i'm just saying that you need the LINE IN to be active no matter what since the MAIN MIX doesn't show up with the TAPE TO CTRL ROOM depressed, and since the TAPE TO MIX button is ultimately useless in this setup solely because of the bleed that would be injected into what is being tracked.

although my mixer is from the MX series, i tested the functionality of the TAPE TO buttons, and they totally cut off the MAIN MIX in the PHONES and CTRL ROOM outputs. the UB manual implies that the functionality is the same, so there is no reason to assume otherwise.

but anyway, even if the mix were present when the TAPE TO CTRL ROOM button was depressed, you would have nowhere to go if the playback at full volume were still too quiet under the MAIN MIX on the mixer. it is better to have both the volume of the playback and what is being tracked easily accessible in the same location (software).

a.k.a. Porp & Mr. Muffins
Member
Since: Oct 09, 2002


Nov 14, 2003 05:14 pm

Quote:
. it is better to have both the volume of the playback and what is being tracked easily accessible in the same location (software).


I agree! That's how I do it in my studio.

Quote:
even if the mix were present when the TAPE TO CTRL ROOM button was depressed, you would have nowhere to go if the playback at full volume were still too quiet under the MAIN MIX on the mixer.


Ahhhhhh... I see what you mean... True. Apparently that wasn't an issue for ozgeorge, though. For him it was the other way around. The mix was too loud and the monitoring was too quiet. This could be fixed easily by going into the software mixer and bringing down the mix playback level, then adjusting the entire level using the phones/control room knob on the Behringer. If the situation was as you described, however, there wouldn't be an easy way to fix it.

What all the confusion comes down to is there was a question of whether or not the tape to ctrl room switch effected the main mix going to the control room. You are right. The main mix is shut off when the tape to ctrl room is down. Good call :)

So, as I said originally, have the tape to ctrl room button down all the time and keep the line ins on your soundcard's software mixer UNmuted.

Excellent. Conflict solved!

Bane of All Existence
Member
Since: Mar 27, 2003


Nov 14, 2003 05:43 pm

NOW we are saying the same thing!

a.k.a. Porp & Mr. Muffins
Member
Since: Oct 09, 2002


Nov 14, 2003 06:10 pm

Yes! Resolution! I thought this thread would never end in agreement... I thought it would either disband in complete and utter confusion or else we'd just agree to disagree.

...Now all we need is the okay from Waldo and we can call it case closed ;)

Member
Since: Jan 08, 2003


Nov 14, 2003 11:28 pm

We all said the same thing, that 'if' the tape to CTRL room mixed with the main mix, it would work...

Only confusion was with whether that particular board did it or not, and it sucks if it doesn't!

W.

Member
Since: Oct 27, 2003


Nov 15, 2003 12:26 am

yeah boys :) i have got it all sorted...

the thing about this board, and not others apparently, is that what is being played through track one is ALWAYS present in the control room...

so when i listen to the control room i actually hear the same signal twice: once as it goes through the control room and then again in the TAPE INS coming back from the computer... there is a small delay as well which kinda creates a chorusy effect... not bad in itself but i have found it better to kill the signal being recorded on its way out of the software... this way i just listen to the prerecorded stuff coming in on tape ins and my tracking track as it goes into control room from mixer.

piece of cake :) having lots of fun too....

thanks for all the help...

ozgeorge

Bane of All Existence
Member
Since: Mar 27, 2003


Nov 15, 2003 12:37 am

wow! haha!

Member
Since: Oct 27, 2003


Nov 15, 2003 01:43 am

oh my god. you arent going to believe this...

after all that, it appears we were wrong...

i just did some more testing on my set-up:

the track is not always in the control room. when the TAPE TO CTRL ROOM button is depressed, all you hear in the control room is the tape. nothing else. (ie no track from mixer)

so muting line in on control panel means you hear nothing.. nothing at all. not a sausage...

however... what this also means is that what i am monitoring is a pure mix of whats coming out of my software... and hence all my levels and what not can be controlled in there... making monitoring pretty easy...

so its still all good... just not quite how we thought....

i have some other questions... but they are kind of unrelated... and about noise... maybe they would be best asked in a new thread :) this one sux.

ozgeorge

Bane of All Existence
Member
Since: Mar 27, 2003


Nov 15, 2003 01:48 am

yeah that is the way it is with my mixer, and it's what i was trying to get across. it's the way i use it at home, and it's very flexible.

a.k.a. Porp & Mr. Muffins
Member
Since: Oct 09, 2002


Nov 15, 2003 09:50 am

Yeah, that is what some of us thought. But I don't blame you for not reading every word of this thread, as it it is quite mind numbing and we were all being very confusing.

Basically, the first thing you described was the way Waldo and I thought it worked, and the second way you described was the way Minkus thought it worked!

So I was just about to say "I told ya' so" and then you had to go and find out it really worked the other way ;)

This is basically what we were debating for the last 10 posts or so, and the way it works is the way I originally assumed it worked and I think it's the best way for it to work. It's good to have just the Tape going to the control room. I think that's ideal.

So good job and good luck :)

Member
Since: Jan 08, 2003


Nov 15, 2003 10:14 am

I wasn't debating really, I was simply saying 'if' it mixed, it would work one way, and if it didn't it would work the other...

Sucks that it doesn't, but I guess, for how cheap the board is, you can't expect much.

W.

a.k.a. Porp & Mr. Muffins
Member
Since: Oct 09, 2002


Nov 15, 2003 10:57 pm

Okay, cool. I actually spent like 3 hours fooling around with my own monitoring setup (It was time for a change) on my mixer today. At the end of it all, I ended up putting it back the way it was. I needed a "tape to alt 3-4" button which they decided to leave out of the design, apparently. They've got a "tape to mix" but no "tape to alt 3-4." Oh well, such is the way of things. I tried all different possibilities, but I kept of running into roadblocks. I wanted to get it so I could have my monitors and my headphones on separate volume controls. I've been debating getting a headphone amp, but as it turns out I don't think I really need one. I got a nifty little headphone jack splitter, and I'll just continue to shut my monitors on and off whenever I'm recording. Works fine, just a little more effort needed, that's all :)

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