Recording electronic drums
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Posted on Mar 15, 2010 07:25 pm
SirEnvy
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Member Since: Dec 31, 2008
Whats up guys, awhile ago I posted something about recording onto my computer. Well now is the time I am ready to dish out the cash and get what I need. I have a nice computer now(built myself) and I also got Sonar Home Studio 7 for my DAW....so now heres the part. I have a BR900CD that I am selling on eBay for cash for what I need..So, I think, if I am correct, that I need an audio interface and a electronic drumset(obviously)....I am looking at an M-Audio interface thats around 350 bucks...what kind of suggestions/help can you give me while I take this journey....
p.s. I also would like to record my guitar/mic/ keyboard as well...
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Mar 15, 2010 07:42 pm Well, if you've got the system resources, i'd definitely go midi. The drum module on my kit does actually sound quite nice, running threw my PA system i'm quite happy with it. Helps me take out a good bit of anger and frustration ;] But when it comes to mixing, it wouldn't really sit in with the music quite as well as actual sampled drums would, especially with a program like superior drummer 2.0, which you can adjust the settings on the mics, including ambient and room mics, process them with effects, etc. Also, if you record strait off of an electronic kit module, you won't have individual control over each drum.
For an interface, pretty much the standard HRC recommendation is the Line 6 UX2. $200, you'll get a very good quality piece of equipment, with the Line 6 Pod Farm guitar/bass amp modeler. Lots of cool stuff for vocals and keyboard as well. It doesn't have midi, so if you do end up recording from a program (idk how others compare to S2.0 but i'm pleased with it). You'll have to buy a small midi interface, <$50. Drum set, again IF you are going the midi/program route, just go to your local music shop and test out the kits they have there. See what one you like the feel of the most. The roland kits seem pretty nice to me, mine was about $1k.
olddogMember
Since: Jul 02, 2003
Mar 15, 2010 08:17 pm In that price range you can pickup an M-Audio Fastrak Ultra with 8 inputs/4 Mic Pre's, Phantom power, and Midi In/Out it's a nice unit for the money and would handle all of your recording needs. Any thing better is going to $500 & up.
For EDrums, Roland is probably the best, but also the most expensive. It all depends on how kit you want as too what it's going to cost. If you're looking to go used, I'm going be selling my Roland TD6V kit, PM me if you're interested.
You might also want to consider something like JamStix for your drums instead, it's a whole lot cheaper, and unless you're a really good drummer, it will do a better job of it without having to resort to programming or loops.
Dan
SirEnvyBEAST MODE [ON] OFFMember
Since: Dec 31, 2008
Mar 15, 2010 08:44 pm Nice thanks for the suggestions...I know that my Sonar Home Studio 7 comes with EZ Drummer...but I am sure I can take one of your suggestions and use it as a VST...........Fragile: you mentioned that it wouldnt sound as good as if I went from module to cpu.....are there any programs that can help me with the individual mixing( I am not going all out, its a home studio that I want to start with a band I am putting together)...............olddog, the interface I was looking at was the Fasttrack ulta, I checked it out and and its sweet, especially recording just about anything.
SirEnvyBEAST MODE [ON] OFFMember
Since: Dec 31, 2008
Mar 15, 2010 08:45 pm Deleted By SirEnvy
Mar 15, 2010 10:26 pm Oh really? comes with EZ Drummer? awesome. That should sound pretty good. And if you already have it, why purchase anything else haha. But ya, the thing is with recording MIDI as opposed the direct outs from your drum module, you'll have so much more control. Most noticably of course is the fact that you can correct any outright mistakes, and depending on your drum chops you can write parts more complicated than you can play.
Little side note there, idk how good of a drummer you or your drummer is, but typical rule of thumb is the more human expression you can get, the better and less mechanical it will sound. If you're able to play the part flawlessly, go ahead and use that direct take, maybe cleaning up the preformance here and there by moving any obviously bad notes or cleaning up that fill you just didn't quite land right. Or changing cymbals for more variety. If you're like me and you kind of play drums but can't really do that well, you can program the drums in yourself, then record a take of you just playing one piece of the kit so you can focus, and swap it out or use it as a programing reference guide. Especially for cymbals and the snare. It still won't be quite as good as a real human drummer, but if you aren't able to play the part yourself, its as good as it gets.
back to the point, other things you have more control over is EQ, compression, panning. And even if you don't get that detailed with it, i definately prefer the sample VSTis over the stock sounds on the drum kit.
So that said, once you get your own electronic kit, play around with each (since you already have EZdrumer) and see what suits your needs best. But while shopping keep that in mind. Make sure the kit has a MIDI out, and if you're tight on money, you could get a kit that doesn't sound all that great with the sounds it makes, but trigger EZDrummer and get a killer sound.
As for the interface. Personally, i'd stay away from M-Audio. I had a fast track pro and returned it. The latency was much much higher than my UX2. I really don't think the preamps sounded any better. The drivers kind of sucked, and with line 6 you get some processing tools. Idk how many inputs you need though, that fast track ultra has 8 i/o? Might be a good idea to have 8 depending on how you record. IMHO no one person needs more than 2 inputs unless they fall into one of three categories. Micing a drum kit, using room ambiance mics, or is recording a band. It sounds like you're recording a band. So it'd be a good idea to let them have the option to track together, or even just for recording jams. So the ultra old dog suggested may be a good route for you.
Just out of curiosity, how are you planning on recording the guitars?
Mar 16, 2010 01:15 am i personally would vote for a more analogue approach:
for recording drums my choice is to control every track or drum instrument (snare, cymbals, toms, etc.) seperately. this will do with any drumcomputer on the market korg, boss etc.
if the drums are ready for recording always record the midi track for sync and changing the kit reasons. so you are able to modify the drumkit in sound or add fills and fx in the same tempi later in the mix.
i also would give each track a seperate fx recording - if once its clear which reverb characters and rooms are wanted e.g. ambience for the kick, gated plate for snare and concert hall for the cymbals or compression for the mixdown of the whole kit.
software modules are somehow hard to handle by making them work with other software - instead of just buying a reverb unit and plugging it in and selling it for a newer version.
with this set up you save budget and the i/o device is sufficient with 2 channels (line6 is still a good choice). the intention is to rather buy a 2 channel high class device and tickle its limits than an 8 channel budget version.
stay tuned! ;-)
SirEnvyBEAST MODE [ON] OFFMember
Since: Dec 31, 2008
Mar 16, 2010 09:46 am Sounds great, I am leaning toward the line 6 now, since it can do all of the bells and whistles(especially if I plan on going with the midi route) or I can just get both(after I sell my BR900CD) I like the idea on just playing one piece at a time, hitting the snare then hi-hat, but I would give the full play though a shot first.
I plan on recording the guitars from my effects, to my floorboard, then through the audio interface...but if I got the line 6, I may not need that, but like I said, I rather have options then none at all.
Wow, didnt think this was going to be this complex, but, I need it, and really want all of this, and this is the reason why I come to this site! You guys are awesome.
Mar 16, 2010 01:28 pm So, you're not micing it then correct? Yaa i'd totally go for the Line 6 gear then. Even without the "bells&whistles" the UX2 is a very solid piece of equipment. Idk, i do realize the fast track pro isn't the best M-Audio has to offer, but it certainly didn't impress me one bit, and its the same price as the UX2. And the amp modeling is really nice. Plus, idk. Personally i like having a tool like Pod Farm to use to add some sparkle to the vocals and acoustic guitars. It comes with plenty of FX which can be used on more than just guitars.
Quick note on micing vs modeling, it seems to me that in the average home recorders budget, modeling is preferred for more modern sounds, micing is better for vintage folks. Not gonna get into the debate, that just seems to be the views i've heard on the forums. Modeling's cheaper too.
But ya, like i said. If you get the UX2 or UX8, they don't have midi inputs. But you can buy a midi interface for real cheap. The UX8 comes with all the amp models unlocked (called Pod Farm Platinum), which if you have the cash, i'd recommend buying the upgrade. The new amps are pretty cool imo. A few more FX too. Then you have to decide if you need 1, 2, or 8 i/o's. If you record an acoustic, i'd get 2 (one to mic it up, one for DI) and if you're in a band i'd get 8 so you can all jam. And, if you do have the money to get that upgrade for podfarm Platinum the prices all work out pretty closely between UX1/2/8.
UX1=$150 + $250 to unlock = $400
UX2=$200+ $250 to unlock = $450
UX8= $500, comes with Pod Farm Platinum
And thats all average pricing. If you shop around, you could find the UX8 for $450 i bet, maybe even $400 if you're a good bargin hunter. But ya, don't feel pressured or anything to absolutely disregard all other options or spend more than you have to. I'm just throwing my ideas at you shamelessly:P If you don't play with a band, the UX1 or 2 does just fine. And if you buy UX1/2 and feel confident in the sound you're getting, you don't have to chuck another $250 at it. Trust your own instincts and think every purchase over thoroughly, its a major PITA to return stuff constantly *cough cough me*
SirEnvyBEAST MODE [ON] OFFMember
Since: Dec 31, 2008
Mar 16, 2010 06:44 pm Fragile, thanks alot for your input, I know you probably have better things to do then help out a noob, like myself, but we all started there at one point. I am def. going to look into the UX8, because I have heard the Line 6 UX2 is the way to go, and they said that back when I first was interested. That was about 6 months ago, and have saved accordingly...and its time to spend the money! Again, I cant thank you all enough, especially you Fragile for helping me out!
SirEnvyBEAST MODE [ON] OFFMember
Since: Dec 31, 2008
Mar 16, 2010 07:14 pm Alright, I am actually focusing on the UX2 right now, and how would I get an midi interface to work with the UX2? Meaning, how would I plug the interface to the midi, without taking the one and only USB slot that would plug into my CPU? Or would I just convert the midi to usb, and plug direct into my PC?
Mar 16, 2010 07:34 pm Oh only one open USB slot? is there any way around that? An open slot on the motherboard to expand the USB? Or unplug something unnecessary for recording (printer? USB mouse if you have a port for one of those old type of mouses?).
Anyone else know much on those USB expander thingy ma jigs? lol, the type that plug into a USB port and then have like 4 more open. Will that somehow lower the audio quality or anything like that while recording, even if nothing else is plugged in?
SirEnvyBEAST MODE [ON] OFFMember
Since: Dec 31, 2008
Mar 16, 2010 10:22 pm no sorry, lol, I re-read what I post and I know why you are thinking that I have only one USB slot on my CPU....no, the UX2 only has 1 usb, that goes into the CPU, and I am asking if I would just plug in my USB straight to CPU and bypass the entire UX2 its self.....I think thats the way I would do it, and my EZ drummer would recongize the electronic drumset.
Mar 17, 2010 07:56 am OH! haha, thats probably my fault. I skim-read a lot.
Ya, you'd want something like this: www.google.com/products?q...n&scoring=p
It plugs strait into your computer, that one is $23, not a bad price at all. The only thing is, do you have win 7? I'll check again, but i'm pretty sure M-Audio hasn't upped the drivers for this yet (another reason i don't really like that company much, but it was the cheapest interface i found).
SirEnvyBEAST MODE [ON] OFFMember
Since: Dec 31, 2008
Mar 17, 2010 09:48 am nah, I have *cough* vista *cough*......
Mar 17, 2010 11:03 pm Yupp, a quick google search confirmed it. 32 bit, right? they support the uno for 32 bit for certain, maybe 64 as well. i didn't do much digging though. I'm hoping before i record my next track i'll get this stupid thing working somehow for win 7. hopefully i can get it to work :P i've been having some massive writers block/ unsatisfactory problems. I feel like i'm spreading myself too thin and need a little bit to find my footing, and a distinctive style. But at the same time, i really want a new song to call my own! rofl, oh well. I'll have a new song one of these days.
