JSX combo vs JSX half stack

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Member Since: Nov 19, 2008

I had asked about the jsx stack before and how to record with them... Now I am trying to determine if I should go with the half stack version or the combo version... I will be using it for home recording and occasionally live performance. I am trying to see if it is worth the extra money to buy a half stack. What do you think the advantages and disadvantages of the two choices? Which one would you choose? Why?

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I am not a crook's head
Member
Since: Mar 14, 2003


Mar 30, 2009 06:52 pm

They're both 120-watt tube amps. So both of them are just ridiculously overpowered. You'll never be able to max them out because they're so friggin loud you'll go deaf before you get the master volume up half way. Unless you have an extremely soundproof home, you'll never be able to even approach max volume of those amps. If you ever gig, you'll never be able to get them past 1 or 2 on the master volume without drowning out everybody else in the band and pissing off the sound guy.

At least the combo has a half-power switch, but halving the power only provides a -3dB change in perceived volume. So 3dB quieter than deafening is still silly kinds of loud.

If you're going to record with it and only occasionally gig with it, give a try to the Mini Colossal in the JSX line. Pair that with a 1x12 extension cab and you'd be set. You'll be surprised to hear how loud even a small amp like the Mini Colossal can be when sent throug an extension cab.

See, this is one of my hot-button topics. I'm very opinionated when it comes to this, but I believe that I speak from experience. There are 2 schools of thought on the subject:

- I need a stack so I can look cool while on stage, or
- I need a tube amp that I can crank to get good power tube saturation and great tone

The first school of thought is mainly held by younger people that put form over function. If you're compensating for biological deficiencies or if you actually play in stadiums to tens of thousands of people, then by all means, buy a 120-watt tube amp. If you're playing huge venues with no PA system, buy a half stack. You'll need the power. That's why 100+ watt amps exist, they're relics of a bygone era where guitarists actually NEEDED that much power to be heard in large venues. Once that image of rack after rack of Marshall 100 Watt heads next to a wall of 4x12 cabinets became an iconic symbol of rock and roll, future generations of guitarists insisted upon having it because they thought they had to have it to be a rock star. I'm trying to spread the gospel to the world that this is utter bullshit.

But the second school of thought is held by people who have actually heard how good a tube amp sounds when its turned up loud enough to push the power section into breakup and/or saturation. Then you use the preamp gain to suppliment the power amp's distortion. Once you hear that wonderful tone, you'll never want anything else. And if you buy an amp with so much power that you can't turn it up past 2 without having your neighbors call the cops, then its pretty much a waste of money IMO.

For recording and occasional gigging, go for the smaller amp. At home, you can crank the smaller amp to full tilt, get all sorts of power tube saturation, and still walk out of the room with your hearing intact. At a gig, you can crank the smaller amp for stage volume, mic it so the audience can hear it, and the sound guy will be happy as can be. My motto is If it ain't loud enough, mic it!

Czar of Turd Polish
Member
Since: Jun 20, 2006


Mar 30, 2009 06:59 pm

I'm with tad on this one. Lower watt tube goodness for recording, mic it live.

My Vox 2x12 has a wattage dial which comes in handy when I haul it in the studio. Cool feature, wish my other "favorite" ampeg amp had one.

I am not a crook's head
Member
Since: Mar 14, 2003


Mar 30, 2009 07:06 pm

I wish I had the self-control to say it in so few words, Tripps :-)

This is just a topic that I get really worked up over. There's a reason that the low-wattage tube amp market is really taking off. As more and more people record at home, there is a growing need for amps that can reach power tube saturation at much lower volumes.

Hell, put a 5-watt Epiphone Valve Jr. through a 4x12 and tell me its not loud enough for any job.

And thankfully they JUST now invented this awesome new thing, called a mic-ro-phone. You can put one of these mic-ro-phones in front of a sound source, and you can have that same sound reproduced by your PA system, no matter how loud or soft it is! Imagine that! I think these mic-ro-phones will really take off soon.

OKOKOKOK, rant over. It just kills me that home recordists want 120 watts of power when they'll never, ever, ever be able to get their amp into the sweet spot without the Army Reserve showing up from 3 counties over.

Member
Since: Nov 19, 2008


Mar 30, 2009 07:43 pm

It shows that I am greener than hell :) sorry for bringing up a touchy subject. I tried the mini collosal but the only thing that put me down was the absence of the controls. There is only one tone knob. And I totally understand you; even with 5 watts its loud...

But since both of them are 120 watts (the combo and the stack) what is the difference???

I tune down down...
Member
Since: Jun 11, 2007


Mar 30, 2009 07:44 pm

Sorry if I step on toes here Tad... But, I didn't read but like 3 lines from your post. Haha.


There is a good reason to get a cab/head setup over the combo. One, the response on a cab is better with a full frequency range than a combo. They can sound GREAT but they just don't get the lows and low mids that 4x12's get.

Two, the "head room" that much wattage can give you is great. Some people don't like that "break up" of the power section. I'm one of them. And since the power rating is the same on both the head and combo, it'd be better to have just the Head/combo out of shear basic power distribution between speakers. That's ONLY if they even have the same speakers.

Also, if you have the chance( and this is just convenience, and not worth the price tag to some but, having your head in the control room to adjust it being mic'd in the live room is a GREAT help.

http://www.reverbnation.com/2ndg
Member
Since: Nov 27, 2007


Mar 30, 2009 09:25 pm

im with you Cynic.
ive got a a 80 watt combo and a 120 watt tube 4x12 and there is no comparison.

sure its ridiculous loud but the end recorded result is right up there with the best. (for heavy at least)

having said that, i would use the combe for clean stuff.

Czar of Midi
Administrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002


Mar 30, 2009 09:56 pm

I normally recommend a Power Soak or the like to attenuate the overall volume level when recording something that loud.

You don't really want to record it at full volume as it can really raise problems when mixing.

If you need it live, that is one thing but bringing that much power into the studio is not needed at all to get gut wrenching distortion and crunch.

I am not a crook's head
Member
Since: Mar 14, 2003


Mar 31, 2009 09:36 am

OK my own personal bias aside, a head + cabinet is probably more versatile than a combo. With a separate head, you can decouple the speakers from your controls and sit with the head in a control room while your cabinet blasts in the live room (although its rare that home recordists have separate live and control rooms).

Another benefit is that you can use a variety of cabinets with your power amp with a simple plug of a cable. With a combo you either have to rely on an external speaker output or replacing the combo's speakers.

Another benefit when playing at loud volumes goes in the cab + head's favor, and that's combatting rattles. Tube amps are rattly by nature. The tubes pick up vibrations, the spring reverb unit picks up vibrations, the cabinet itself and all of its' innards all vibrate when things get loud. With a separate cabinet you can move it away from the innards of the head and reduce audible rattles.

As far as a 2x12 vs. a 4x12, I can't say I'm convinced that they will sound much different to a microphone up against the grille. The larger dimensions of a 4x12 will sound different, but not necessarily better. It's up to you, listen to both and go with your ear.

I agree on the lack of controls on the Mini Colossal. As much as I ***** about high-powered tube amps, I play through an 80-watt tube 2x12 combo myself. I chose it because it had features not available in the lower-powered amps in its line (Traynor Custom Valve series).

But there's one thing that makes my monster of an amp usable in my home, and Noize touched on it: a power attenuator. Factor in the cost of a power attenuator with your amp purchase, its vital to be able to get the best tone out of your tube amp. The Weber Mass is affordable and wattage-specific. The THD HotPlate is more costly and is resistance-specific but has deep and bright switches plus built-in noise reduction and a post-amp line output. I can't stress enough how useful a power attenuator is going to be with such a powerful amp.

Sorry to go off earlier, but I get all evangelical when I smell someone about to buy an amp that they might regret later. Before you go home with it, do me one favor. Crank it all the way up and play and entire song. If you still go home with the amp, so be it.

I tune down down...
Member
Since: Jun 11, 2007


Mar 31, 2009 01:32 pm

+1 Haha.

Czar of Midi
Administrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002


Mar 31, 2009 09:53 pm

I'll also toss in the fact that even with the Valve Jr. that we have here. Granted it is modded for higher gain and is only 5 watts. IT needs an attenuator as well to get good break up without splitting my eardrums, even through the single 12.

I am not a crook's head
Member
Since: Mar 14, 2003


Apr 03, 2009 02:39 pm

I just saw this and immediately thought of this thread:

www.peavey.com/products/b...%26reg%3B50.cfm

Looks like they're going to release a 50-watt head version of the JSX. I think that's a great idea since those 120-watters are so overpowered.

A 50-watter is still going to be loud as hell, but it'll respond to an attenuator even better while being much more tolerable to crank up.

I tune down down...
Member
Since: Jun 11, 2007


Apr 03, 2009 02:41 pm

Nice!

Just wish they were so gaudy looking.

Czar of Turd Polish
Member
Since: Jun 20, 2006


Apr 06, 2009 01:17 pm

Hmmm, 50W JSX... that is nice. My neighbor has the 120W with the matching cab, it sounds quite fantastic with any of my guitars. Plenty of tone control on those beasts.

http://www.unitedmusicians.info
Contributor
Since: Nov 11, 2007


Apr 08, 2009 08:24 pm

@Tadpui

I am not nearly on the same technical competency level as you or many of the other frequent contributors on this forum, but I agree with you 100% on the big amp front. I'm glad to see that you're so passionate about it. It makes me feel less crazy for all the drunken ranting I've done.

I've finally found a suitably ugly little amp and I'm embarking on a quest to give it great tone(and it already does a really good job). That being said, I've never modded an amp before so I may be naive as to the limitations of the little beasty. It will be a fun experiment at the very least.

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