DAW within FX loop of an amp ???

> > > DAW within FX loop of an amp ???

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Pinnipedal Czar (: 3=
Member Since: Apr 11, 2004

To be able to utilize the dynamics processing, and fx of Sonar as part of a guitar rig .

Anyone ever done this ?

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Czar of Turd Polish
Member
Since: Jun 20, 2006

Jul 09, 2008 06:29 pm

If I understand correctly, you want to run your guitar (mic'd, line6'd, etc..) into your DAW and be able to monitor some FX applied from Sonar while tracking\playing live right?

In audition I can do this, but honestly even at the lowest buffer setting the latency is too audible to play along to, it throws me off. I just apply someting after tracking, I know this can be tough to do as you don't get the real feel of it, but that is my experience.

Line 6 with it's tonedirect is the only way I can achieve this, it still sends to the PC and back but there is no audible latency as it bypasses your DAW 100% as far as processing goes (I believe it is hardware level only).

Czar of Midi
Administrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002

Jul 09, 2008 10:53 pm

It is doable for the most part.

But as Tripps stated the latency issue might be something to worry about. Although with a fast enough computer it might not be an issue at all.

Sonar has been able to do live fx for a long time. But starting with 5 and 6 they made it much easier and plausible.

I'd give it a try, you can't wreck any gear if that is what you are worried about.

Pinnipedal Czar (: 3=
Member
Since: Apr 11, 2004

Jul 10, 2008 09:53 am

Right on . I figured it was possible, being a line-level signal, but just wondered about the latancy thing . With 'input echo' on in Sonar, the latency is barely noticeable in my DAW... I'm not really sure how it would be in the compy I was going to use for this experiment . Maybe I'll get a chance this weekend to give it a whirl .

Thanks guys .

www.TheLondonProject.ca
Member
Since: Feb 07, 2005

Jul 10, 2008 10:25 am

You might have to mess with your buffers a bit but I've used the Guitar Rig plug in within Sonar and played live. It shouldn't be a problem at all....although I will say that some plug-ins are more CPU intensive than others so YMMV.

Pinnipedal Czar (: 3=
Member
Since: Apr 11, 2004

Jul 10, 2008 01:04 pm

Dig that BH... thatnks .

After a bit more thought, I'll prolly have to wait until after the album sessions are done before I rip the AP out of the recording compy, as I'm still needing the midi-puts of that card for the control surface, but this one is deffinately on the top of my project list .

Specifically, I'm looking to use the Doppler plugin from WAVES for some subtle pitch-shifting . What a sweet plugin that is !

I've never really dug the few stomp pitch-shifters that I've heard,(always "too much") and the Digitech Studio harmonizer(would be perfect) that I use for vocals has a non-working line in/out, so this would be so sweet if it worked well enough to do the live thing .

Freeleance Producer/Engineer/Gtr
Member
Since: Aug 11, 2002

Jul 10, 2008 03:01 pm

I like this post. I've been using DAWs on stage for a while now.

Using a DAW's processing live is great... of course you're at the mercy of your OS, so keep a backup DAW handy or have your effects in hardware form at the ready.

We use Pro tools live and we're experimenting with Ableton Live for it's "on the fly" abilities. the DAW handles our in-ear monitoring, processing, automation, playback of synths, effects and amp switching (great for us guitarists who are fx heavy and sing too for less tapdancing).

We've had our issues piping a whole band through the DAW. We've had the crazy latency issues and have ironed them out in practice. Of course live anything can happen... we've dealt with the stutters and buffer issues and DAE errors, which blow. But you can recover gracefully if you're prepared, which means have plan B hooked up too, which can increase setup time (and investment).

Soon Pro tools will handle just our in-ear monitoring and static processing, while Ableton will handle the playback, effects automation and channel/patch switching. So 2 DAWs live.

Since you are using the DAW for your personal fx, that should be a lot of fun. if you could sync it up with the rest of the band by creating a click track for the drummer to follow, then prgram your changes and automate your fx... or you could get a MIDI controller that can control the DAW, instead of using mouse. so find a midi footpedal that you can assign the Control Commands of Solo/Mute operations so you could have separate tracks with the same input with different plugins, then just stomp to solo or mute individual or grouped tracks. Or just to control one plugin and assign encoders for tactile control of the plugin's parameters.

Good Luck and have fun!




Czar of Midi
Administrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002

Jul 10, 2008 09:49 pm

el-musico, good to see you.

I have to jump in on your bit though and warn you about Ableton Live. I have converted several users to Project 5 as they were having constant issues while running live, on plenty powerful rack PC's so that was not the issue. It was the fact they could not mix live without experiencing huge drop outs and even system crashes.

With Project 5 version 2 that is all history. I do complete program sets for several DJ's from around the globe and a few here stateside. I have used Ableton and still program a few sets for it, but I'm getting fewer these days. Most have switched to either P5 or even Sonar for the fact it runs without drop outs and you can edit live while its running without fear of it going bonkers on you.

And yes, it will do all the same things as Ableton and way more.

Just some food for thought.

Pinnipedal Czar (: 3=
Member
Since: Apr 11, 2004

Jul 11, 2008 11:56 am

Good to see you again el !

Uhm, wow . There are certainly a few scenarios that this type of set up would benefit that I hadn't thought of . Very cool ! As long as I can get the same way-low latency out of my 'lil DAW as the big-un... things should go smoothly . Although, I'm not sure if I want to put my drummer through the whole live-click-deal . I know that wouldn't make me too happy, if I were him . heh
Tasty food for thought, guys ! This is going to be sweet when I get around to it ! : ) Jus' got'ta knock this album out... goamph .

Freeleance Producer/Engineer/Gtr
Member
Since: Aug 11, 2002

Jul 11, 2008 03:14 pm

Thanks guys, when i get some time i'll stop by to see whats going on. Good to hear from you too, I hope everything is cool.

Project 5 huh? I know you have been working with that for a while now. I'll look into it, thanks!

> > > DAW within FX loop of an amp ???

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