for all you amp modeler useres out there....

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Member Since: Apr 26, 2002

This looks pretty sweet.

www.atomicamps.com/

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Member
Since: Jul 02, 2003


Feb 27, 2005 02:30 pm

Interesting, but if you run your Pod, GT6, Digitech etc, thru any tube amp it would be the same thing. :)

Dan

Hello!
Member
Since: Jan 12, 2004


Feb 27, 2005 03:09 pm

I thought that...the solution here, methinks is to get yerself a kickass poweramp, a big MASSIVE set of speakers and blast away!!!!

With the VAMP, its quite good. I'd imagine (from what dB says) the POD would also be good..that'd kick *** for sure.

AND, ye could use it for other things!

Coco.

Member
Since: Apr 26, 2002


Feb 27, 2005 04:25 pm

Olddog:

(Q) Why not just plug my POD into my Twin, Classic 30, etc?
(A) Plugging a modeler into a regular guitar amplifier negates the modeler’s purpose, which is to model.
There are many high quality guitar amplifiers available and people love them because of their own distinct
sound and feel. This is the main reason we have modelers; to model the tones produced by these great
sounding amplifiers. The fact is that the quality of a modeler is measured on the scale of how well it can
accurately duplicate the feel and tonality of the amplifier it is trying to duplicate. A modeler set to Marshall
stack, or VOX AC 30 plugged into a Twin is going to sound like a Marshall stack, or VOX AC 30 plugged
into a Twin.

Coco:

(Q) Wouldn’t a power amp or full range PA be a better choice?
(A) This is a very valid question, and in theory is a great idea. The answer is “feel”. Many guitar styles
require playing the amplifier as well as the guitar when performing. In these situations the Reactor 112 is a
champ! There is a HUGE difference between the feel a guitarist gets when playing a Reactor vs. playing a
PA speaker.

Banned


Feb 27, 2005 04:28 pm

my peavey delta bass head with my peavey cabinet (2-10's and a tweater) works super with my PODxt.

but running my podxt into my fender hot rod deluxe, not so great.

I am not a crook's head
Member
Since: Mar 14, 2003


Feb 27, 2005 04:37 pm

Isn't there an issue when performing live with modelers when you switch presets because it doesn't happen instantaneously? Like there's a little delay after you select a preset before it actually loads? I've heard this complaint about the V-AMP, not sure about the POD. I think that's part of the reason why they came up with the POD Live footboard thingy.

Member
Since: Jul 02, 2003


Feb 27, 2005 04:40 pm

Cabinet & or amp modelling is easily bypassed in modellers if one so choses, there are still all the various effects the units are capable of when using them with an amp.

I don't see how the Reactor is going to be any different in that aspect it has a preamp/amp and it has a speaker so it's going to have it's own sound just like any amp/cab.

Dan

Member
Since: Jan 18, 2003


Feb 27, 2005 04:44 pm

i dont think its pointless to plug a pod into a live amp even with the cab emulators engaged. i did it for shows and it made my amp sound a thousand times better. in such a case, the amp modeling software contributes to the overall patch sound and becomes more like a sound-shaping tool.


Hello!
Member
Since: Jan 12, 2004


Feb 27, 2005 05:19 pm

I tried running my VAMP thru my Marshall clean and the Marshall/VAMP sound was awful!! The effects were cool when using no amp at all in the VAMP...BUT...as Tad pointed oot...its redundant for that if ye wanna switch effects as ye get the wee stupid 1ms delay!!!

However, I would say, for fx, if ye are using it for that and NOT switching, its good.

It really is meant for DI recording IMHO and also, limited live use i.e. if ye stick with the one sound throughout a song to avoid the delay (which I would normally do anyway)...thru a PA it does kick *** - I done it and it rocks.

I know what yer saying Johnny - I am new to the modeller after only 2 years and 14 with an amp..I just know for me, its all aboot volume. And, the sound I had with the VAMP thru a big momma PA rocked...tho yer right - I did miss the amp itself for playin with controls etc...but, I love ma volume!!! hehe.

Dunno - its a cool idea. I'd surely consider at least trying it. What I think is cool and I WILL try is the Line6 / Behringer AMPS WITH modelling onboard...that would be worht a look...specially in a stack!

Coco.

Member
Since: Jul 02, 2003


Feb 27, 2005 07:06 pm

Well preset changing on the GT6 is instantaneous, I don't know about the POD or others. The GT6 is first and formost an effects processor meant to be used in place of pedals, but it's well equipped for recording direct as well. It makes my little Cube 30 amp sound tons better when I use it with it as well.

Dan

Hello!
Member
Since: Jan 12, 2004


Feb 27, 2005 07:07 pm

VAMP suffers from the "latency" (guess thats what it is huh!)...pain in the *** for sure as its top other than that.

But, its meant for DI recording I guess...after all - if it were meant for the road, God would NOT have made it plastic :-) !!

Cheers

Coco.

Banned


Feb 27, 2005 08:09 pm

i still believe that stand alone pedals are the only way to go for effects, no pod, gt-6 or other multi effect device can match them.

Member
Since: May 15, 2004


Feb 27, 2005 08:22 pm

Totally agree.

Administrator
Since: Apr 03, 2002


Feb 27, 2005 08:24 pm

they can't march the noize level either.

pedals suck...in my opinion...I'd never go back to using them except in live situations on a rare occassion.

I am not a crook's head
Member
Since: Mar 14, 2003


Feb 27, 2005 11:07 pm

Dog you have a Cube 30? I think that amp would be about ideal to play a modeler thru. A friend of mine just got a GT5 and he's just raving about it. I gotta admit its a pretty impressive machine. I bet that playing it thru a Cube would do it justice.

I gotta have my pedals man! All it takes is 1 noise suppressor *cough*NS-2*cough* and it tames my 2 noisy pedals.

Member
Since: Jul 02, 2003


Feb 27, 2005 11:34 pm

Yep Tad. :) It's a great sounding little amp by itself, but the GT6 really makes it that much nicer. I don't use it much but it's nice to have around just in case.

I used to have several pedals as well, my 2 favorite being my ProCo Rat, and a BOSS CE. But with the GT6 I pretty much have all the pedals I need. :)

Dan

Member
Since: Jan 18, 2003


Feb 28, 2005 01:41 am

i do think the pod's *effects* leave much to be desired. (dont know why they cant make em a bit better). and for live playing, the little delay between patch changes can be a real problem. however, the basic sound i get in plugging it into an amp with cab modeling engaged, well....it sounds fine. the cab modeler in that situation just basically changes the EQ curve. you can think of it as a bank of EQ presets. for the boss multieffect units, though, i dont think the distortion sounds natural. just my opinion. the cleans on those things, however, are stellar.


Member
Since: Jan 27, 2003


Feb 28, 2005 07:24 am

Mesa boogie mark iv and a quadra verb is all I have ever used on the road...try to get a modeler to get that sound. I use a johnson in my home studio for low level recordings. Do you think Gary Moore, Clap,Beck, David Gillmoore uses a modeler.....amps and a mic all the way baby!!!!

Hello!
Member
Since: Jan 12, 2004


Feb 28, 2005 07:38 am

Guitar Slinger...ye'd be surprised who uses a modeller these days. I think, any artist who truly wants to grow in his/her craft should embrace technology...after all, what do you think the first guitarists to use feedback had said of them...."Do you think xyz used an amp"..."Acoustic all the way baby!!!"... ehehe.

Yer point, I can see. But for many, like me, there is no way in hell I will ever own teh pile of amps I wanna own. A VOX AC30, Marshall Stacks, Matchless hand made, Krueger, Fender Twin Verb, etc etc - I'll never have EM ALL. I do have a lovely Marshall and love it dearly but I also love ma modeller tae..its progress and I am ALL for that. At the end of the day, as soon as the sound is amplified, its no longer "true" to what it was. Its already being distorted with EQ, PREAMP, EFFECTS, SPEAKER, etc etc - so, what odds does it make HOW ye distort it....

That said, I do like the amp + mic combo too. My point is..its not a competition. Use em all man...use em all and love em all....!

Cheers

Coco.

Member
Since: Jul 02, 2003


Feb 28, 2005 03:31 pm

Well everyone has there own preference and reason for recording with whatever method/equipment they use and it's pretty pointless to debate the merit's of each, no one is going to change anyones mind, just use what your happy with, that's what I do. :)

Dan

Administrator
Since: Apr 03, 2002


Feb 28, 2005 03:41 pm

Yeah, it's really not an issue about better or worse, it's an issue about getting the job done.

The thing that gets me isn't when people have different preferences, cuz that's actually cool, but when people refuse to even give another method a chance...such is the case when any new technology comes out and some old school peeps refusing to accept it or try it, thats where it can be a thorn...the ol' "don't knock it if you haven't tried it" thang...

Banned


Feb 28, 2005 10:31 pm

hey im not knocking modelling but for effects i prefer them to be in analog pedal form especially chorus/flange/wah. ive only had my podxt for a very short time and it is solid!!!, i bought the model packs too, its so fun to shuffle thru all those amps and i spend alot of time doing it. fun fun fun

Member
Since: Jan 27, 2003


Feb 28, 2005 10:50 pm

Damn this is a hard one to explain!!!!

If I can record a guitar player and catch the room and the warmth of the amp...it sounds more true than a amp modeller. They call it a modeller for a reason, I love them ... Nothing like coming home or jumping on the bus and every one wants to sleep but you .... your bangin away on a modeller working out your next song, demo, or CD project. To get true warmth and room feeling you must turn it up and mic it multiple ways. You got to catch the true sounds of the amp and the room (Warmth Brother). To much music today is done with out warmth and room feeling...have you ever worked with a known producer that will stop in the middle of some place (bathroom , hallway, any place)and clap their hands just to listen to the rooms sound. I have worked with some people and it took me along time for my ear to hear the differents ..... believe me I am still learning every day (that is why I work with the old dogs). Modellers are great for writing songs and so on....but believe me You must have the edge to be on the top with a modeller (big money) ...and a $500 modeller is just what it is called...make it sound as close as possible to a true sound in a true room with a true mic and kick *** preamp. Why do you put a kick on tape? Can't model that sound in digital and still feel the warmth of the tape. Just my 2 cents....and I will always listen to someones opinion...Thats how we all learn in this trade. Sorry for the run on!!!! Its like a black man playin the blues baby.

Banned


Mar 01, 2005 10:57 pm

wouldnt yet get alot of the same mic'ing say a vetta amp?

Member
Since: Jan 27, 2003


Mar 02, 2005 07:11 am

In Brain Duster I used A Line 6 Vetta Amp on the road and in the studio. The only way I would use a vetta for recording would be to set it up in a room and turn it up on a great sounding cab and mic it multiple ways. Vetta amp is a great sounding amp as far as all the diffreent sounds go. Again this is just my opinion. I like a good cab and head with multiple mics in a great sounding room. Remember you can always add effects to a wav file...you can't take them away. So lay it down dry and add latter that way the engineer has control of the wet feel of the whole recording...so if true...do you need the kitchen sink. JMO

Hello!
Member
Since: Jan 12, 2004


Mar 02, 2005 07:18 am

Aye Guitar Slinger

I do agree with ye to an extent here and yer points are very valid...again, its down to taste as ye say but tis a good point. I too like the sound of a MIC'd cab or amp...tis good.

I just also like the modeller. I guess, ye can have yer cake and eat it if you do both. Its basically how I plan to record my next EP. A combo of MIC'd Marshall, DI Mic'd Acoustics and my VAMP for both too. Digital effects in Cubase and Amplitube...between all that, I should have every base covered which is all I care aboot.

But aye, the 57 or 58 (with the grille unscrewed I found to work same as a 57) works well...very well indeed. I shall be doing this for the next song I record actually...will post the song up when its done...I would agree wi yi tho - would tend to record dry(ish) and add multiple effects later in CUbase.

Coco.

Administrator
Since: Apr 03, 2002


Mar 02, 2005 08:17 am

For some people, I know it's the case with me, is that partof the decision making process is also about convenience. I record music now for my own personal enjoyment, and have long lost the "I wanna be a rock star" thing.

I want to record high quality music just the same, but also tempered with convenience. I like my POD and Bass POD very much, I just did some session playing for a guy laying down some bass lines using my new Bass POD XT and the dude I was doing it for loved it.

Yeah, there is a merit to a mic'd cab and all that but for many it's just not a convenient option in a family household situation. I don't want to schedule my inspirations, I just wanna put them down when they come, so a modeler is the best option by far.

Member
Since: Jan 27, 2003


Mar 02, 2005 01:16 pm

"but for many it's just not a convenient option in a family household situation. I don't want to schedule my inspirations, I just wanna put them down when they come"

You have just nailed it on the head DB. Convenients is why modelers are so popular. I love my Johnson J Station, for that reason. I get home from a gig at 3 or 4 in the morning and have an insperation I can put on the head phones and lay down my thoughts. As far as a rock star...no I just love to play music live and make my money doing something I don't call work.

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