Recording School??
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Posted on Feb 07, 2005 03:41 pm
TowerofSong
The Skeletal Circus Derails
Member Since: Oct 06, 2004
I have been thinking about attending a recording school or taking some classes. I came across this school in CA www.expression.edu/sa/index.html
Can anyone give me advice or recommend any schools?
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Feb 07, 2005 03:55 pm i was 19 and attended Atlanta Institute of Music...i did the Bass Guitar program and it was pretty good...thing was, i was young and livin' on my own for the first time...lemme tell you, if you get a buncha teenage musicians together from outta town, there will be some partyin'...so i didn't get as much outta the school as i'd like. that was my fault. what wasn't my falut was my passing grades i was getting, i was 3/4 of the way through and still couldn't read music! the teachers were all musicians that did their own thing, and i really don't wanna talk smack about them because they were all real good people (Adam Nitti, Tom Knight, Alan Barnes ect.) but the place was run more like a business then an accual school, so as long as i paid my tuition, i got a passing grade. so if you like the school atmosphere, then it's all good....i found i like to learn things on my own and i do better that way. for some reason if i am told what to do, it's an instant turnoff and becomes "work".
Feb 07, 2005 04:21 pm I am still a big fan of the school of hard knocks.
Jason H.Jack of all trades master of ___Member
Since: May 28, 2004
Feb 07, 2005 04:30 pm School of hard knocks where tuition was a pound of flesh and a pint of blood....
TowerofSongThe Skeletal Circus DerailsMember
Since: Oct 06, 2004
Feb 07, 2005 04:41 pm But you still have to purchase equipment at the school of hard knocks. If I were to use that money towards schooling, maybe I could do this full time...
I'm also 22, married, and have a salary job. If I were to go to a school, there would be no partying.
Thanks for the replies
TowerofSongThe Skeletal Circus DerailsMember
Since: Oct 06, 2004
Feb 07, 2005 04:46 pm El musico,
I would like to talk to you more about the school you went to. I can tell you one of the things I like about, it compared to everything else I have looked at, is the fact that it is in Arizona. It's a shorter distance from where I live, and I've always wanted to visit Arizona.
Were you able to get a job went you graduated?
Feb 07, 2005 05:41 pm Quote:
If I were to go to a school, there would be no partying.
Well, then it's about what's important to you...if partying is that important to you, all the school in the world won't help anyway...life isn't about partying, partying is what you earn the right to do after you get a life...common misconception in my opinion...
Sometimes to get what you want, partying stops until you get it, time to grow up ;-) sucks, don't it.
Quote:
But you still have to purchase equipment at the school of hard knocks. If I were to use that money towards schooling, maybe I could do this full time...
Or if you do both you could do it full time in your own studio...
Feb 07, 2005 05:49 pm yeah that's my goal.....if you go to school, you come out with a buncha knowledge and debt, and have no gear of your own. whereas if you take the same money and put it towars the RIGHT gear, and learn how to use it effectively, you'll come out with gear and experiance....i'm not tryin' to talk you out of school, but i do wanna stress one thing. if you go to school, there is NO gaurentee you'll come out and land a job. when i lived in Tampa, alotta studios in the area hated the kids commin' outta Full Sail, and wouldn't give them a second look. usually because they could run a 48 channel SSL board and Pro Tools TDM, but had no "real world" experiance with gear that was less than top of the line.
good luck
wyd
TowerofSongThe Skeletal Circus DerailsMember
Since: Oct 06, 2004
Feb 07, 2005 05:50 pm Mr. Masters,
I believe you misread my statement. If I were to leave my job and my family there would be NO PARTYING. I would try and get the most out of the opportunity...
I was commenting to someone saying that they did not get the most out of there schooling becuase of partying too much.
TowerofSongThe Skeletal Circus DerailsMember
Since: Oct 06, 2004
Feb 07, 2005 05:56 pm Quote:
Sometimes to get what you want, partying stops until you get it, time to grow up ;-) sucks, don't it.
I consider having a family, a career, and ambition grown up.
Feb 07, 2005 06:04 pm Perhaps I did misread it, if so, I apologize. That is not at all how it came across to me.
That said, I don't personally consider grown up as being set by what you "have" but more what you are...but eh, that's getting pretty off topic.
TowerofSongThe Skeletal Circus DerailsMember
Since: Oct 06, 2004
Feb 07, 2005 06:25 pm Apology accepted.
And I did not mean to come off like I am almighty because I have a family, career, etc... but I have worked hard to get where I am and I guess I took the "grownup" comment personally because I've had to be "grownup" all my life. But like you said... that is off topic.
Thanks for the advice.
GeoffSM7b the Chuck Noris of Mic'sContributor
Since: Jun 20, 2002
Feb 07, 2005 06:43 pm I've been doing the school thin for the past 2 years . I've taken a few classes at on of the near by schools , I've sat in as an intern at a local Sacramento studio, I have my own home studio, and right now I'm taking online classes from Berklee in Producing with sonar . I also Have a full time Job, I'm married, have a kid on the way and get to party. If you put you mind to it you cna accomplish anything. I feel I'll being going to school the rest of my life, not because i have to but because i want to.
ToerofSong- the school I'd like to go to is the one in Tempe AZ too . It looks like the best learning envorment .
I still think some of the best learning is from doing . So I'm in agreement with db . I think school works for some and dosn't work for others . i've found it useful because I've been able to use equipment that i couldn't afford and compare my stuff the the pro's/teachers, and see where I went wrong.
TowerofSongThe Skeletal Circus DerailsMember
Since: Oct 06, 2004
Feb 07, 2005 07:06 pm Very well put Geoff. I agree with everything you said.
el musicoFreeleance Producer/Engineer/GtrMember
Since: Aug 11, 2002
Feb 07, 2005 09:03 pm Everyone can aggree that the bottom line is: You get what you put in. I know people that have graduated my school and work in Hollywood assisting with major albums AND I know people who are back at their old jobs like telemarketing and retail. It's how you apply yourself.
As far as getting a job, I have been doing home recording for about 5 years on various DAWs and had starting taking paying gigs at my home studio and working for myself. With the help of the internet and trial and error, I had made a decent name locally and opened my home studio to clients. I had left my job at Intel to be self employed and wanted some education so I would feel more at ease with my decisions, not to mention that my wife has 2 degrees and was pushing for me to "certify" in my field.
I thought I knew a lot going in, but there were many half-truths I thought was gospel and there were a few bad habits I had adopted until going school. I had almost NO analog board/tape experience, no real post-production/commercial, or surround experience either and now I feel that I can deliver any client what they need as a local or major client.
I recently graduated from the Conservatory of Recording Arts and Sciences (CRAS) and am now building a 3 studio facility, so yes I have a job.
CRAS will help you get an internship based on your preferences but it really depends on your ambition to get any further.
rez
Feb 08, 2005 01:14 am Towerofsong,
You should be aware that the recording industry is undergoing many changes because of the home recording revolution. Pros with decades of experience are finding it harder to get work. Many fine rooms are now closing due to the lack of clientele. There will always be a niche for the big studio that hires engineers, but it is dwindling.
The big studios do major projects, but the wannabes are their bread and butter, and we all know what the wannabees are now doing. They are discovering that with the help of Behringer, Mackie, MXL, etc that they can do it themselves or at least think they can. Major artists are also recording at home.
Learning comes with experience and you don't have to pay for that. You just need to do, like Db, and others already mentioned. It used to be that the recording artists depended on a team of technicians. Now like the sculptor, painter and photographer, they can be in complete control of their vision if they apply themselves. Sorry, I don't mean to be depressing, but before you jump, make sure there's something to jump to.
RigsbyUltra MagnusMember
Since: Nov 13, 2004
Feb 08, 2005 06:42 am I went to recording school after i'd done quite a few years of recording and all i'd say is check out before you go how much of the curriculum you could easily get from buying the program or device and reading the manual, it's an awful lot of money to not have the gear at the end of it. Things like acoustics (which really captured my imagination) were well worth it, but some of the other classes were literally reading from a manual and tips you can find on the net and in books without much searching. Classes may be a better option, the you'll have a greater chance to spend your money wisely.
Feb 08, 2005 06:47 am I am totally in agreement with Karyn, the digital home studio has really changed the face of the industry.
Anyone, with the proper amount of time, attention and ambition can learn to do it themselves and while you still spend money on it, you spend money on a tangible product rather than the education. The education then comes naturally from using the gear, asking questions and sharing your experiences at places like this where we learn from each other for the betterment of each person.
I eagerly await the full impact of the digital revolution in the music industry, as it's going to be big. It's cheaper and easier for peopel to record themselves, as well as make and market their own recordings via the internet...it couldbe a real shakeup in the coming years.
Jason H.Jack of all trades master of ___Member
Since: May 28, 2004
Feb 08, 2005 08:25 am Wow that just spun my view on things...I almost feel enlightened...
Thats cool to hear from Karyn and dB because thats kinda what we all do anyhow is create our own expertise by "doing". I am not so charged on going to get educated thru an institution after all...
I am only now beginning to feel confidence in my knowledge. And thus far everything has been self taught by me or the fine folks here...
Feb 08, 2005 08:33 am I have thought of taking some miscellaneous tech-school classes in some things that are not my strong points in the process, but I would never spend the money for some silly piece of paper that says I completed x-amount of education.
I know too many people with too many book-smarts and no street smarts, and they can't do anything in their field of education cuz they have no real-world education, just theories and hypothesis.
Not saying a person won't gain useful knowledge in a classroom, cuz obviously you will, but it's applying it that one can't learn in a class room. Also, mostly every class is taught on ProTools, and likely on Mac, which, while still being the dominent force in pro facilities, isn't in the home market. So when it comes to schooling, to me it depends on your budget, your goals of owning your own studio or working for another, and other such factors.
I dunno, what the hell do I know...that's just my two cents.
Jason H.Jack of all trades master of ___Member
Since: May 28, 2004
Feb 08, 2005 10:00 am First off I dont want to downplay anyone who wants that schooling...If your graduating HS and don't have any other intrests...or whatever situation may be...full steam ahead.
A local school here (IPR) wants 30 grand to accomplish a 2 year AAS degree. Ok cool, but its way too rich for my blood. There's a mentorship program out there for like $5000 that isnt schooling but the process is the same...except you work IN an actual studio with an actual engineer/owner. No piece of paper just real world experience supposedly...
My client and his artists are always boasting about MACs and Pro Tools but the only feasable way I would concieve going that route is compatibility with the big houses...Even still, for me that is a far feteched reason...
dB is dead on about the field vs real comparison. I gotta gal here who is dumber than a bag of hammers when it comes to real world experience but can do anything in accounting...In the big picture I would compare her to Jess. Simpson.
RigsbyUltra MagnusMember
Since: Nov 13, 2004
Feb 08, 2005 10:14 am It wasn't all macs and pro tools at my audio school to be fair, there was a variety, but still, for seven grand a year you can buy a lot of gear frankly. Slightly off-topic, but i don't think the best computer for recording is necessarily mac, the carillon PCs are awesome, audio-dedicated and practically silent even from the ground level machines, i think these start around £700 (UK), £1200 for something i'd personally really quite like, add in some decent mics (maybe £2-3000), a couple of nice pres (say a grand), cables and headphones (£200), couple of compressors.. active speakers.. stands etc etc and for that first year's fee you have a pretty nice set-up with which to do your demo reel. Kind of speaks for itself IMO.
Feb 08, 2005 10:18 am Also, but, be aware that MANY of us make do with less costly home built computers, myself being one of them.
RigsbyUltra MagnusMember
Since: Nov 13, 2004
Feb 08, 2005 10:48 am Oh yeah, absolutely, and me too, just saying where all that money could otherwise go. If i had my time again i'd skip the school, spend some money on a good set-up and maybe use some of the rest to support myself while i interned somewhere.
GeoffSM7b the Chuck Noris of Mic'sContributor
Since: Jun 20, 2002
Feb 08, 2005 05:55 pm if my schooling wasn't paid for by the military ,I'd be 100% on the do it you self band wagon. truth be told 90% of my knowlage has been atained from doing, and finding info out on my own . Trail and error is probably the best teacher . I'm just lucky to have a GI bill that pays for school, if i didn't have that i would not have not done any prof. education. My home studio has been the best teacher I've had.
lucky13Your mom's favorite sonMember
Since: Feb 07, 2006
Feb 07, 2006 10:46 pm Like El Musico, I also graduated from The Conservatory. I loved going to school there! Basically, the school and their 8 studios are open 24/7. I slept in the chairs there many nights, because I couldn't stop playing with everything. They have SSL's, NEVE's, Neoteks, 2 inch machines, Pro Tools, Logic, and more...but the coolest thing is that they let all of the students have full access to everything 24/7. The classes weren't in classrooms, they were in control rooms! The teachers taught a lot of cool techniques, and filled in some of the holes I had from teaching myself. But I learned the most by playing with all of their gear night after night.
GregorMember
Since: Jan 08, 2004
Feb 11, 2006 11:48 am I also went to a recording school here in Canada. Recording Arts Canada. It was an eye opener to say the least and I agree with whosyourdaddy00 in that it was run more like a business than a school. It did give me experience in a real studio and with things I could never afford.It also gave me computer experience which I didn't have before. Also the guest speakers we had come in and talk with us was very very cool! I learned a lot of stuff from just that experience.
All in all it was a great experience but when looking back I could have used the money I spent on that school to buy some great gear. Hind sight is always 20/20 though.
I now own and operate my own studio and I'm quite happy with what I've achieved with my schooling and my real world experience. Going to school gives you a piece of paper that gives you a helping hand but I went in '99 and I'm still paying for it!
Feb 12, 2006 04:45 am Well, anyone who is achieving any sort of success in a start-up studio format is definately doing something right. I live in Toledo, OH and the market here is very small and tight knit. Much of my knowledge is from book and magazine references, friends in live sound, local area music stores, websites/forums, networking, and operating my home studio. Its become obvious to me that if moving isn't a possibility, armed with a little knowledge and desire, one can actually create a nonexistant market. I believe that an entire music scene can grow exponentially from something as simple as a hot recoring studio. 2 1/2 years ago I was recording a hip hop session and this cat stopped over twice while we were recording who wasn't part of the group I was recording. Both times he was playing guitar and singing in a seperate room. Since I was running the rig, I didn't have a chance to clearly hear him but my friends said "man you gotta record this dude sometime", 6 months later he won 4 consecutive weekends in a row at the Apollo in NYC signed with Sony, opened many shows for John Legend, and sold over 600,000 copies! Unfortunately, I hit major financial turbulence, closed the drywall contracting co. that was funding the recording equipment, moved back home with mom & pops, and got back in school for business management since then. The hip hop artist who I did record a song with was later offered a deal with the Digital Underground and passed on it due to family reasons. Crazy. The bottom line, without the KNOWLEDGE to record, roots in the local scene, and good people skills, oppertunities like this never prevail. School may or may not be a necessity, but the way you practically apply that knowledge, I believe, is the skeleton key.
