Feb 26, 2010 01:52 am If you're recording direct with no amp, then yes, you're correct that PodFarm replaces the need for FX pedals.
Does Podfarm eliminate the need for pedal-fx?
Posted on Feb 26, 2010 01:15 am
pipedreams
Marijuana Czar
Member Since: Oct 01, 2009
I looked at some of the screenshots of Podfarm and there was like a picture of a delay pedal there :S
Does that mean that Podfarm does all the guitars fx aswell as the amp modelling?
If it does, then I wont need to use physical/real-life fx processors/pedals right?
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Feb 26, 2010 01:52 am If you're recording direct with no amp, then yes, you're correct that PodFarm replaces the need for FX pedals.
Feb 26, 2010 07:17 am Plus with podfarm its typically best to record dry. even if you have some pretty nice FX (like, my boss flanger sounded a little better imo than line 6's, but line 6's stuff is gonna sound a lot better than your digitech multi FX unit).
Anyway. if you record dry. then you're able to add in and adjust the FX after the fact. Which comes in handy.
Feb 26, 2010 02:56 pm I've used PodFarm extensively. Here's my analysis. If you get a decent tube pre-amp like ART Studio V3 you can forget PodFarm
Problem with PodFarm, IMO is that you need to have your pedal board plugged in, or be using Line6 interface. I just have the pedal board, so this is a little annoying, since I'm also a gigging muscian.
The other problem is that the plugin, even if you put it on the track while the pedal was plugged in, goes dry if you unplug the board. So you have freeze the track in order to keep the sound. So, get a tube preamp and forget the plugin, then the sound becomes punchier anyways, which is what I like.
The plugin usability is great...and the ability to try different things with one dry signal is REALLY nice, but to be honest, once you get your tone down, you won't be using 800 of their presets. You'll use 3. Clean, dirty, heavy...then delays and reverbs on top, which you don't need pod farm for. So, that's just my opinion.
Feb 26, 2010 03:16 pm Well, if you just use a preamp while recording you're not going to be getting any amp modeling. Which, EQ'd decently will give you an O.K. clean tone with a nice neck pickup on a les paul or like a tele. But it won't be that great clean even, and any sort of overdriven sound you're gonna need some sort of amp/cab modeler or of course mic an actual amp. Not to mention other effects.
And if you get the plug in version of PodFarm, all you need is an iLok key to hold the license. The reason it doesn't work unless plugged in is to stop piracy so that people actually have to pay to use their product.
Also, if you get the tone you want, you can bounce the track in your DAW, giving you a WAV file with the VST plug ins already processed, so then you could remove your pedal board and have the processed sound still play. Pod farm won't even be running.
Feb 26, 2010 03:25 pm Although I'm one of the last people on earth to be defending modelling technology (I'm a "air-pusher" so to speak hehehe), I have to take exception to that advice by nyjbarnes.
First off, the ART Tube MP series of preamps barely earn the distinction of being decent preamps. They're a starved-plate design, just like every other tube preamp in the sub-$500 price range (except the EH 2ube preamp). This means that the tube is there almost exclusively for marketing purposes. It's effect on the tone is negligible. On some of those starved-plate "toob" preamps, they actually have orange LEDs positioned behind the tube to make it look like it's glowing, because there's not enough power going through the tube to make it light up. What they end up doing is designing the preamp with attenuated high frequencies so that they can describe the sound quality as "warm". Usually what you end up with is a muddy quality that, when stacked up over several tracks, sucks the high-end frequencies (and with them, the sparkle and liveliness) out of your mix.
And running direct from your guitar into a preamp (toob or solid-state) then into your interface is still going to yield a pretty dry tone. "Punchy" wouldn't be an adjective I'd use to describe it. Punchy would be what I would describe a power tube being run at full plate voltage, not a preamp tube being run at a very low plate voltage.
I wouldn't say that you could replace the modelling capabilities of a product like the PodFarm with a budget preamp, or any single preamp for that matter. The fact that you CAN freeze the track and keep the effects intact is the saving grace of using any piece of outboard gear for effects in your mix.
Plus with a modeller, you get cabinet simulation, which is necessary when you don't use an actual amplifier in an actual room, using actual speakers pushing actual air and interacting with the room's walls and ceiling to produce a reverberant tone that simply isn't there when you record direct.
Sorry, this is starting to sound like an attack on you, nyjbarnes. It's not intended to be. It's just that when you record direct with no cabinet simulation, you end up with a much different (and much less desirable) tone than when you do use any sort of cab sim or modeller. BUT, if you like the tone that you get going direct through your ART preamp, that's all that matters. Tone is subjective, and if it sounds good, it is good!
Feb 26, 2010 03:51 pm Buy a great amp, great stompboxes and a mic and it will sound 10 times better.
Feb 26, 2010 04:04 pm Quote:
Buy a great amp, great stompboxes and a mic and it will sound 10 times better
While deep down that'd be my advice as well, it's hard to suggest that to someone who's just starting out. Spending thousands of dollars on an entire guitar rig isn't advice that I'd give out when a couple of hundred dollars will buy this guy a huge improvement over what he's currently using to record.
Feb 26, 2010 06:00 pm Thanks, I'm ditching this digitech pedal and getting podfarm, but ive already got a mixer & dont wanna buy the Line 6 UX8 ect to get it, what should i do? if need be, ill sell my mixer but i dont really want to.
Is there line 6 gear for people in my position? or doesnt it matter & i just use podfarm on it's own, with my current mixer? lol midi guitar, not too keen on the idea.
* since joining this site my recording process has been hindered if anything, coz ppl give you better ways of doing stuff and it just blows out everything you've been doing :@:@:@
Feb 26, 2010 06:52 pm Wow... i had no idea they would actually FAKE the heating up of the tube sometimes. thats lame. lol. Somehow the market LOVES to pray on people who know a little bit about recording equipment, mostly stuff they've over heard from a friend or Guitar Center worker lol. It seems like a third of the companies out there are just trying to prey on the ignorant (and before joining HRC, i was definitely in the boat with those who were easy targets for deception tactics like "tube tone!!!"). And heck, i still don't know hardly anything about recording and mixing besides the basics. But at least now i know enough to write new material and record it in quality that satisfies me, which is what this "project" is about for me.
Anyway. On the Modeling Vs Micing debate. I think it comes down to 3 factors. No matter what. you can't beat modeling for the price. $150 bucks and you can get pretty impressive sounding home records. But. It has its limits. And theres like what, 3 modeling programs sold in stores. And hundreds of amp companies. Maybe one day modeling will have breakthrough programing developments and can truly rival a high end amp or even blow them out of the water. but with only 3 companies developing the programs at the moment, that day would be a LONG ways away.
Factor 2, style. I've heard plenty of high gain recordings that sound terrible from a mic'd amp on peoples myspaces, a few HRC recordings, and even a couple low budget commercial releases (breaking benjamins first album, saturate, comes to mind). Not to mention my own quarrels i had with an i5 and a 2x12 combo amp. Even clean guitar, sometimes the room ambiance or something with the mic technique just doesn't fit with whats in style right now on any sort of budget. Getting a good high gain recording with the type of cab and amp i was using was not easy. And Deon could probably testify to that as well (he has a lot more equipment than me:P). For high gain styles, there's just SOMETHING difficult about micing an amp. But, if you take a look at Tadpui's music page and listen to his guitar work, you can't get that vibe out of a modeler no matter how hard you try. There's just something.. almost emotional missing from PodFarm for that style, even with extensive tweeking.
Factor 3. And most important to me, convenience and feel. For me this is all about writing music. Not engineering it. I just want to be satisfied, and hassle free. Once you get your amp and mic set up just right, i'm sure its not as much of a hassle. But still, its nice to not have my mother knock on my door at 1 am telling me for the fourth and final time to shut that stupid amp off. 0-=) BUT, on the flipside. If noise isn't an issue. There is something about the rumbling of an amp on your feet that may not travel across to the recording realm, but it does while you're playing. Personally. I hated the way my ears and entire body felt while playing with my amp for an hour. but others, understandably so, couldn't live without it.
So, thats my thoughts there. haha sorry, just had to rant for some reason ;D
Anyway. @pipedreams. Theres a few options here. I would suggest getting a UX1 or UX2 if you don't need to record jams. Or even if you do record jams, maybe record them with a room mic. (though of course if you want the extra inputs, and have the extra cash, go UX8). The reason i suggest getting one of these is bc with your UCA202 you're PROBABLY going to be lagging too hard to process the signal with pod farm. If i remember, those things have high latency. You could try ASIO4ALL or something. Idk. I'll let others guide you there. Just go into cubase and check your latency. I think anything over 50ms may be a bit too high not to notice a delay. i could be wrong though.
But, you can buy pod farm for, i believe $50. Thats the standard version. It doesn't have all of the amps unlocked. I would recommend IF you have the money, getting Pod Farm platinum, which has all the guitar and bass amp models unlocked from the get go. I believe that is $250. But then you are going to need a $50 iLok key to hold the license (piracy prevention). So if you did end up wanting pod farm platinum, it'd be worth your while to sell your mixer, and buy a UX8. Look around for deals. You can find them for $400 occasionally. which would be like $100 more than buying pod farm platinum and an iLok. But giving you 7 more stereo inputs than you have now and low latency drivers. worth it imo, but of course thats only my opinion lol. I don't wanna sound too pushy with where you're directing that money.
Feb 26, 2010 07:41 pm Cheers Fragile
It's decided then, I'll sell my mixer & fx-processor and get a Line 6 UX8.
Luckily I think I have a stooge who would buy the mixer, & the fx i can just take back to the store.
I'll have to keep my friend off this site though lol, otherwise he'll realise like I did.
And just yesterday I was defending Behringer.. I now understand.
Feb 26, 2010 08:53 pm *I had a q but I found a thread nvm
Feb 27, 2010 06:12 am nyjbarnes:
"If you get a decent tube pre-amp like ART Studio V3 you can forget PodFarm"
maybe you meant "if you dont get a pre?"
I couldnt see how getting a pre could mess it up.
I use a Joe Meek Pre with Pod.; sounds sick as.
Feb 27, 2010 07:50 pm Fragile, is that in US or AUS $?
& About using pedals with podfarm, are u saying i cant just plug the guitar into the pedal, then the out of that into my mixer like normal, then apply podfarm plugin?
Is it gonna amp-model the fx on the guitar signal, meaning the fx has to come AFTER the amp-modelling so that it doesnt get distorted if im using a distortion model?
Feb 27, 2010 09:43 pm US dollars. And you can just plug the guitar into the interface. Your DAW will record the guitar signal dry. So then you can play with a model, and change that model and add effects or change them later.
And most of the effects can be selected as pre or post amp. Some things you want before, some after. Usually delays sound best after, and i like my flange before the amp. But you just experiment with what mix sounds the best. Just like if you were using a real amp and micing it up. Some effects you want pre distortion some you want after. And your tastes will dictate which you want.
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