Annoying ground buzz
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Posted on Oct 28, 2009 11:46 pm
Fragile
Member Since: Sep 30, 2009
I'm on a basic HP laptop, using an M-Audio Fast Track Pro interface (sales guy talked me out of the line 6 amp modeler, i'm so easily swayed lol). And i get this INCREDIBLY annoying buzzing to my PA system (no money for near fields yet :\). I'm assuming its some sort of grounding issue, but i'm not sure.
Hmm lets see what interesting details could help you guys diagnose this.
-The sound is much more annoying when connecting from the headphone jack to RCA, though USB does it too. And now i'm going to 1/4in inputs.
-Some days the buzz is unbearable, sometimes barely audible. Also, it... idk "clips." Its a pretty consistant buzz, but quite often for a few milliseconds it stops and comes back in broken clips, fairly randomly as well.
-When running off battery, the noise stops.
-When the fast track is powered off, the noise is still there.
Like i said, i'm assuming its some sort of grounding issue. Could taking the ground off fix the issue? (by plugging in a 3 to 2 prong adapter that leaves out the ground prong). Or could it be something else? Btw, i have access to my bosses electrical tools. I'm sure i can find a decent tester somewhere.
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Dematrixhttp://www.reverbnation.com/2ndgMember
Since: Nov 27, 2007
Oct 29, 2009 06:52 am ive been thru this exact thing before.
it had something to do with the fact that the phones jack on a lapy is unbalanced first of all.
now i think of it, the list could go on. battery packs, wiring methods, this, that.
i tried ground lifts, balanced, unbalanced leads, different interfaces, you name it.
never got to the bottom of this issue myself, but i tell you one thing it nearly drove me mad, some of the guys here may recall when i first joined here, that this was doing my head in.
If you ask me it was the laptop, i replaced everything else to no avail, then i got rid of the lapy and got a new interface and that was the end of that.
Oct 29, 2009 09:23 am When running off the battery the noise stops, there is your answer...likely dirty, or ungrounded (well, poorly grounded) power source.
One possibly viable option is getting a power conditioner/UPS type of power supply to plug it into to clean up the power a bit...
Dematrixhttp://www.reverbnation.com/2ndgMember
Since: Nov 27, 2007
Oct 29, 2009 09:36 am i dint replace the power pack so yeah, very well that could be it. hopefully it is mate.
Oct 29, 2009 10:57 pm Hmm. I'll do some research on power conditioners :] thanks man.
So like, what exactly is happening here (or in most cases at least). I guess it doesn't really matter, but still. I'm curious haha. Is it the houses grounding or simply the laptops connections (again, i know it could be a million things but what is it in your opinion?)
Man, i really, really, really REALLY hate technology. So confusing :[
Oct 29, 2009 11:45 pm troubleshoot it, one device at a time, start by unpluggin from the laptop....still buzz?
next unplug that connector that goes to the mixer....still buzz?
go through EVERYTHING in the entire signal chain, one at a time, and find out what is causing the buzz first.
after that, we can work on where the ground issue is.
Oct 29, 2009 11:46 pm oh yeah, don't unplug stuff while the power and levels are up....turn master fader down before unpluggin' then back up.
Oct 30, 2009 12:22 am Oh its the laptop all right :\
-unplug the laptop its fine.
-turn off fasttrack, buzz
-unplug fasttrack usb cable, no buzz (also other interfaces i've used have the exact same problem on here. And actually i've had my gear set up at several locations, all have the same buzz)
-Unplug one of the lines to the PA, buzz
-Unplug both, no buzz (no signal into PA)
Anything "completing the circut" from the laptops power supply to audio speakers gives me this problem.
One thing i really should get around to testing is get something other than the laptop to send the signal. I'll start with RCA outputs from...idk something non battery powered haha. Deon said his problem went away with a new PC. Maybe mine will when i upgrade too. I hope so.
Oct 30, 2009 12:29 am can ya run the laptop from the battery during tracking? or plug the laptop into the same power strip as the PA....
Oct 30, 2009 06:28 am Thats what i do haha :] I run it off battery. It is a mega pain though. And i never tried plugging them into the same power strip. I'll give it a go today.
Dematrixhttp://www.reverbnation.com/2ndgMember
Since: Nov 27, 2007
Oct 30, 2009 07:04 am so its settled....time to smash up the lapy!!!!
wooo hoooo, please post before and aftershots.
some lapys just suck, old or new, mine was brand spankin, i got me money back on it though as it kept bluescreening and losing stuff in windows, but yeah, i dont have good recall with lapys.
Oct 30, 2009 11:55 am Haha i so would smash this thing >:[ its SUCH a pain in the arse. Its actually the schools computer though. They didn't like it much when i reformatted the hard drive and ditched all their dumb internet control programs :[
That does bring me to another quick question though, as when i graduate i'll need a PC of my own. It would be quite convenient to have a laptop, but how do they stand up vs the average desktop?
J-botByte-MixerMember
Since: Dec 04, 2007
Oct 30, 2009 05:36 pm Well, a laptop should be totally doable. In fact once I land a job again, I'm planning on saving up for one of the MSI lappys at some point so I can do a portable studio sorta thing a coffee shops (also saving up for a novation xiosynth 25-key for that) And I know there's a number of HRC members who use a lappy for tracking and production as well.
For laptops, my preference lean towards HP and MSI. Dells can be okay too. MSI has some pretty good prices though. www.msimobile.com/
I'm not sure what's considered "average" desktop anymore since I rebuilt mine back in 2004, and it was barely mid-range back then!
But, I can say I don't really like getting ready-made PCs when I can build my own and select exactly what parts I want. Everything from the mobo, to the PSU, CPU, graphics, etc.
Anyway, if you're getting brand name PCs or Laptops, then I think the averages on both are pretty same-ish. With the laptop though, you have the mobility/portability going for you.
Oct 30, 2009 07:03 pm Hmm. Well i'm always for portability. Though now that i think about it, its not a HUGE deal if i need to get a desktop. Its not really that much to lug around if i ever need to bring it somewhere. I'll keep researching though.
Expect a post in 4-6 months about PCs :] I can't spend the money at the moment, but when i have to give this laptop back i'll need something to record on asap :] til then i'll live with the buzz. I don't feel like spending any more than 20 dollars or so fixing a problem that i might not even have when i upgrade.
Nov 08, 2009 11:44 pm Fun fact: The line 6 UX2 has little to no noise going to my speakers. The buzz went away completely when i traded in my Fast Track Pro for the UX2. Just thought you guys, and anyone in the future searching for this might like to know
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Nov 09, 2009 12:13 am Indeed a bonus. I know I really love my Line 6 stuff for sure.
john51Member
Since: Nov 03, 2009
Nov 10, 2009 03:30 am Hello Fragile, For what it's worth I had a 60Hz hum in my monitors and got rid of it by placing a "ground looper" between the interface[Edirol UA -25] and the Monitor speakers,no more hum. The actual name on the little barrel is"Bumper 15 Amp High Quality Noise Suppressor Isolation Transformer, €12 at the local radio shack. Just in case the hum returns.
theskrubIf I were any cooler I'd freeze.Member
Since: Nov 08, 2004
Dec 14, 2009 03:04 am "could taking the ground off fix the issue? (by plugging in a 3 to 2 prong adapter that leaves out the ground prong)"
Definitely try this. I had the same problem with several laptops in varying degrees and now the buzzing is gone. Although my method was to plug into another 3 prong adapter but upside down leaving the bottom prong exposed. Might be dangerous but I haven't been shocked yet. =)
good luck
Dec 14, 2009 09:27 am Hmm. well this problem is gone now but thanks guys.
Your last sentence did remind me of something ive been meaning to ask however. "but i haven't been shocked yet." You see, the other day i was doing these whisper things on the outro of a song, and wasn't using my pop filter. My lips touched the condenser at one point by accident, and i swear it shocked me. Looking like a total idiot, i tried doing it several more times. Maybe part of it was static built up from my socks on the carpet, bc it seemed to do this more when i would come back to it 5 mins later.
It reminded me of this one time at a buddys house when i used to play with a "band" (note quotation marks lol). Anyway, he was on bass and i was pointing something out to him, touched his strings and a very noticable shock went threw me. If i remember right, it only did it while i had my guitar in my hands as well.
This is all just very peculiar, and i don't understand enough about electricity to figure out what is going on here. any ideas?
Dec 14, 2009 09:30 am Oh, the ol bad grounding microphone shock...
Not sure any more, but I remember having an old amp that had a three position power switch. Center was off and either way was on. The two different "on" positions were reversing ground wiring or something. In my first bands practice space, if I switched the on one way, the guitar would shock me, the other it wouldn't...it was a very old house with a bad ground, or no ground, in it's very old wiring.
Dec 14, 2009 01:48 pm The noise that you are hearing, is the screen refresh rate.
This is why it changes. It depends on what you have on the screen at that moment. And if the screen is renewing at that point in time.
Smaartlive has the same issue. This is how I know this.
The simplest, and cheapest solution, is just to lift the ground going to your PA.
The way I do it, is to use a DI. Lift the ground on the DI. And run it into the mic pre of your desk.
The signal will get it's ground from the desk side. And it will be dead quiet.
Dec 14, 2009 01:59 pm Ha! Rob i think you nailed it. screen refresh thing makes total sense. I might try that next time i have to play "DJ" for one of my friends parties. Man big down side to being a nice guy with some nice equipment, friends, or friends of friends, are constantly asking if i can supply some music for them for free, and of course i always oblige haha.
When i do something like that i don't always bring my computer or UX2, so i use my behringer usb interface. The UX2 oddly enough fixed the ground completely. I just wish i understood enough about electricity to know why.
Anyway about the shock. Hmm ya that is odd. It doesn't seem to be doing it now so i guess i'll just hope it stays clean. It did it after a very severe rainstorm last week. that might have played a role. My house is younger than ten years old, but the people who built it cut corners like you wouldn't believe (many were illegal or against the contract from what i understand :\) So i wouldn't be suprised if the house is grounded or wired poorly.
