Using Guitar Rig 3 with Sonar 6
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Posted on Nov 09, 2008 08:30 pm
amcolan
Member Since: Jan 24, 2007
Hello,
I am having a small problem with my recording setup. Im still new at this so any help is greatly appreciated. Im plugging direct to my M-audio Projectmix and recording a guitar track. I then use GuitarRig 3 as a vst plugin. Using this as a VST takes up a lot of computer power so after each track is recorded and the effect is added, I bounce the file to another track and then I can delete the vst from the prvious track and then the computer runs nice and fast again....The problem I am having is that some of the guitarrig settings have stereo sound with two amps going at once and different panning settings. As soon as I bounce the track it doesnt sound the same. Its sounds very tinny and I think its because its bouncing in mono instead of stereo. I checked all the settings before bouncing and I cant figure out why this is. If anyone has any idea why, or can reccomend a different way of using guitarrig. I would greatly appreciate it.
Thanks so much
Anthony
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Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Nov 09, 2008 09:32 pm You need to make sure and check the bounce to stereo or even use the bounce to separate tracks function. I assume you are processing to stereo tracks?
You also need to make sure that all the boxes are checked to send all the effects and EQ to the bounced track.
Nov 11, 2008 02:08 pm I had it working and now im stuck again. I tried the option of bounce to split mono tracks, it worked the first time but now every time i try this it still bounces to one single stereo track.
I choose the track to bounce to(it only lets me choose one) I choose audio fom a single track. then in the channel box i choose split mono. What am I doing wrong?
I think it may have somethig to do with the inputs and outputs of the track. when I record the initial track should I have it set to stereo 1/2, or just to left. also what do i set the two track im bouncing to. one left and one right or both to stereo 1/2?
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Nov 11, 2008 07:59 pm If you are going to be doing a stereo track in the end then yes, record with the 1/2 option as it will give you a stereo track.
When bouncing a track down it should not need to go through the 1/2 options of the audio interface at all as it never should leave the digital realm of Sonar. It is processed in place.
I am wondering now if you are sending the bounce out via the interface and back in. Are you listening to it when you bounce or is it silent?
olddogMember
Since: Jul 02, 2003
Nov 12, 2008 03:28 am Make sure you have the Interleave button set to Stereo on the track before you bounce, Sonar has a habit of resetting it to mono. You shouldn't need to record the track in Stereo and then bounce to Stereo track.
Nov 12, 2008 06:00 pm the reason i am bouncing the track is because the vst plugin takes up too much of my computer speed.
I dont see an interleave button, i do see the tick marks indicating whether it is mono or stereo. when i add GR3 it says mono(one tick mark) how do i change GR3 to stereo.
here are my input options for Sonar. which am i supposed to be using
left projectmix1/2
right projectmix 1/2
stereo projectmix 1/2
then the same for 3/4, 5/6, 7/8
when i choose stereo the recording meter only shows sound out of the left channel. when i choose left it shows sound out of both. Very confusing.
i think the problem may be that GR3 is not runing in stereo. but when i play straight through it to test the sounds it is playing in stereo.
Nov 12, 2008 06:02 pm noize2u...it is silent when i bounce it...it shows a percentage as it processes. it only takes a few seconds.
Nov 12, 2008 06:10 pm Sorry to keep posting, but i thought i might just put a related question on the same thread.
how do i get rid of the delay when using the echo button. right now the only way i can hear guitar rig 3 while recording is to actually have GR3 open when recording.
This is another reason why i am bouncing the track. if i have GR3 added as a vst then if i try to open GR3 at the same time i get this loud clicking noise like the sound is overloading or something. I would use the echo button but the delay makes it too hard to play.
I think i am doing something very very wrong.
olddogMember
Since: Jul 02, 2003
Nov 12, 2008 06:12 pm In the bottom left corner of the track there are 2 buttons, one for interleave the other for reversing the phase. The interleave button looks like mmm... sound waves, when in mono they are only in 1 direction, when in stereo they go both ways. You'll know its set right because you'll hear GR in stereo even though the track is set to mono record. Bounce to a stereo track and you should get the correct stereo output recorded. You might also want to check the plugin properties in the plugin manager and make sure Force mono isn't selected.
Dan
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Nov 12, 2008 06:15 pm Oh man, I think I'm catching onto what might be going on.
Are you plugging your guitar into one channel of the Project Mix? If so then that is what is happening. It is only going to be a mono signal coming into Sonar because of course the guitar is mono before it hits the GR3 pluggin.
I think the only way around it to get a stereo signal in the end is to send the track with the VST on it to a stereo bus. And then you can mix the buss down and loose the track with the VST on it.
Nov 12, 2008 06:20 pm noize2u i tried adding it as a stereo buss but then i still hear the clean guitar in the background from plugging into the board.
olddog im gonna go check the plugin manager and look for the interleave button. will reply shortly
thanks for all the help
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Nov 12, 2008 06:21 pm On the echo thing, you need the input echo on to monitor the effect that GR3 has on the dry signal. Without it you will only hear the dry signal.
And that is why you are having to open GR 3 as the stand alone, which by the way you should never do. You can blow your speakers as that will cause one huge feedback loop, or if using headphones you may blow your ear drums out. And I am not kidding about that part.
Nov 12, 2008 06:39 pm ok ...i found the interleave button and that was the problem. as soon as i changed it to stereo everything worked. i didnt see the button because i had to drag open up the track size, it was hidden on the bottom.
about the echo, how do i get rid of the delay. when i put the input echo on there is almost a 1 second delay....way too hard to record that way.
thanks for the tip about the feedback loop. that could have been nasty.
olddogMember
Since: Jul 02, 2003
Nov 12, 2008 06:42 pm The inerleave button is on the track, it's also on the mixer right above or below the MSR buttons.
Dan
Nov 12, 2008 06:46 pm Got it....thanks for the help. that solved the stereo problem.
do you know how to get rid of the delay im getting when i turn on the input echo?
olddogMember
Since: Jul 02, 2003
Nov 12, 2008 06:46 pm For the delay when using the Input Monitoring you need your ASIO buffers down around 256 or lower so that the delay isn't noticable. I've used up to about 384 samples but above that the delay really gets noticable. Also if your audio interface has direct monitoring (Zero Latency) you need to disable that so you don't hear a ghost note.
Dan
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Nov 12, 2008 06:47 pm On the delay, you need to make sure you are running the ASIO drivers for the Project Mix. Also make certain they are current by downloading and installing the newest drivers from M-Audio.
Then you will probably need to set the audio buffers in the Project Mix control panel to about 128 to get rid of the latency.
On your PC what is the CPU speed and how much RAM do have installed. This will tell the tale as well if you can get better latency or not without getting any distortion or pops and clicks.
Nov 12, 2008 07:07 pm I think its all working. the delay is gone. I didnt have it on ASIO. What does ASIO stand for anyways. I always skipped over that driver, which was probably why nothing was working.
one last question, do i want the asio buffer as high as possible without getting any delay. is there a reason not to put it as low as possible?
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Nov 12, 2008 07:12 pm ASIO is Audio Stream Input/Output.
As for the buffer, you can set it as low as you can without getting pops and clicks. Be warned though that the bigger the project gets or the more system resource you use the harder it is for it to work without making noise. I generally set it at 128 or 256 and get good results. But then I am running a processor that is 3.3 gigs with 4 gigs of ram so you may not get it that low.
Always use multiples of 128 when making settings as well. 128, 256, 384, 512 and so on.
