need drums help

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Member Since: Jan 18, 2003

^ that's a very rough recent draft of an old song. i never got around to recording it because i found it hard to come up with 3/4 beats.

this is so rough that i'm just playing around with kick and snare here. the high hat is simply a metronome (i'd never leave it 'running' like that all through a song, ever). no time was spent on fills, either. i just find it challenging to figure out how to write the kick/snare during the chorus. you know, as far as 'where the hits should fall.' so if you want to listen, listen mainly to the first chorus.

the structure is intro, verse, chorus, quick rehash of the intro, then a repeat of verse and chorus, then an outro. the drums in the second chorus are 'one draft further back,' so disregard those completely. i was just trying to come up with ideas in the second chorus there.

the verse drums will be easy to work out ultimately. i may or may not update this song to one with louder verse drums (if you can hear them, that means this is a quick remix in order to make them audible) but my questions have to do with the kick and snare during the chorus.

basically, how do i make it work?

seems to me that the chorus begins with seven beats of a 'busy' guitar riff. it's the guitar equivalent of a drum fill. because of this, i strongly feel that the drums should 'walk around' here, before finally settling into a groove on the seventh beat, with the crash.

a friend recently disagreed. but i see no other possibility. it seems to have to be that way. i also think it would work, if done correctly. i don't want a 'random' feel there, but there should be a sense of the drums hesitating for seven beats. trying to 'get themselves together.' but also, you know, sounding reasonable. so, does this idea (if not the execution here) make sense at least?

any basic tips on snare and kick arrangement during the chorus would also be much appreciated. this drum problem threatens to stop this song in its tracks.

hopefully later, when the drums are done, i'll also fix the acoustic guitar's sound (by re-doing it) and the distortion sound. and other things.

*sigh* this song is miles away from anything approaching done. i hate to post 'early' stuff like this, but without input, i simply don't get around to trying again.

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Hold 'Em Czar
Since: Dec 30, 2004

May 24, 2008 11:58 am

i'm hearin'


for the 'main' beat

as for the rest, i'd really have to learn the song more (this is first listen) very zepplinish kinda reminds me of "no quarter"

Hold 'Em Czar
Since: Dec 30, 2004

May 24, 2008 11:59 am

i dig it if i spent some real time 'composing' a beat to this, i know it'd work.

Since: Jan 18, 2003

May 24, 2008 02:38 pm

i wish i could get it to together enough to give it another try. thanks for listening. do you agree that the drums should somehow 'walk around' for the first seven beats of the chorus before settling into some kind of steady beat when that first 'steady' chord hits on beat 7?

Czar of Midi
Since: Apr 04, 2002

May 24, 2008 10:04 pm

forty, from what I can hear of the drums right now I am thinking this works pretty well. Maybe some slight tom work in there but it gives a pretty heavy feel to it as is at the moment.

On the chorus thing, indeed it would add some drama and even a bit more on the heavy feel to have it walk around the chorus slightly before coming in.

I would keep it pretty heavy feeling though when it does come in.

I'll give it a better listen in phones later to see if that makes any difference in what I am hearing.

Since: Jan 18, 2003

May 24, 2008 11:19 pm

ok but it is walking around right now, at the very start of the chorus. or trying to, anyway. it's like a pencil sketch of what the final result would be, as soon as i make some better choices about specific placement.

on beat 7 of the chorus (when the first full chord is hit along with that crash cymbal) i think that's where a more regular beat should begin. but up till then, for the first seven beats, it should probably feel like the drums are trying to 'gather themselves together' into something. sort of leading up to meshing, which would occur on 7.

i've never programmed anything like that. it'd be like an extended fill that sounds only partly like a fill. i dunno.

i think i'm being too inconsistent with the beat the rest of the way through, after beat 7. i don't know what a good mix is as far as repeating kick/snare patterns and slight variation. that's why it's still kind of all over the place after beat 7. don't know how regular to become.

well at least the verse will be very easy. you cant hear it in this sample, but i shouldnt have any trouble with the verse when i get around to really recording it.

Czar of Midi
Since: Apr 04, 2002

May 24, 2008 11:55 pm

Well I just gave a listen in phones a bit louder now. As I stated before I kind of like it in the form it is in now. The drums are working as they should for giving a build up feel to it if that is what you are after. I don't think I would try to hit a consistent type groove with that at all. I would keep the slightly erratic feel it has at the moment as it does make it feel like a very heavy type groove, even if it never gets into a full groove so to speak.

I'll keep listening to see if I can think of anything that might be worth changing, but honestly I like the way they are sitting in essence right now.

Ne'er ate 'er
Since: Apr 05, 2006

May 24, 2008 11:56 pm

I suggest this drum pattern for the heavy 7/4 section.

Kick is K. Snare is S. Beats are eighth notes represented by periods.


Play with that for a bit. Occasionally adding a couple of eighth notes to the snare, kick, or toms at the end of the phrase might help mix it up.

Since: Jan 18, 2003

May 25, 2008 05:39 am

i can imagine something by looking at that. i dont know if it's what you have in mind, but i might play around with it.

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