is it the drummer or me?
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Posted on Feb 07, 2006 04:28 pm
btglenn
Member Since: Dec 29, 2004
recordin a metal type band w/ double kick stuff.
the kick rolls sound really un even, i know the drummers indominate foot is weaker but isnt there a way to get them even. currently using normal compression levels and limiting now. any other tricks out there?
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TadpuiI am not a crook's headMember
Since: Mar 14, 2003
Feb 07, 2006 05:03 pm Has the drummer considered using triggers for the kicks? You could find a good kick sample and use triggers to fire off the sample every time the kick is...well...kicked.
zekthedeadcowEat Spam before it eats YOU!!!Member
Since: May 11, 2002
Feb 07, 2006 06:00 pm triggers is the usual way
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Feb 07, 2006 07:32 pm Practice, practice, practice. I can honestly say it took me at least 2 years to become proficiant at a double kick. But I must agree with the trigger thing. At least then you can adjust the velocity and comensate for the weaker foot.
Feb 07, 2006 07:57 pm Played a nylon strap DW double kick pedal on DW drums for years. My impression after seeing many metal bands, even many signed ones, and closely listening with ear protection to how unclean most play live, is that 90% are triggering in the studio and probably quantizing the triggered notes too. Unfortunately, guitar players & drummers that thoroughly know & practice technique and theory have become a thing of the past as people become increasingly reliant on technology to pull through for them. Practice is king ultimately.
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Feb 07, 2006 08:04 pm Joey Jordison from Slipknot is one of those few who can actually get it right consistantly. At least most of the time. I have a video clip of him soloing and he never missed a beat, even hanging upside down.
fredzsMember
Since: Jan 07, 2003
Feb 08, 2006 12:55 am there are a lot of double kick drummers actually who are very consistent..
Jason Bittner of Shadows Fall
Joey Jordison Of Slipknot
Adrian Erlanddson of Cradle Of Filth
Daneil Erlanddson of Arch Enemy
Chris Adler of Lamb of God
Paul Bostaph or Dave Lombardo of Slayer..
Most of them use triggers, but ive seen/heard live videos from them, and they're really profficient in keeping the time on their kicks.
im a double bass player myself. and from what i learned. Treat your feet like your hands. Because IMO, they're almost the same its just that you have more control over your hands because there is less muscle movement and is a lot lighter. But if im not mistaken the foot or legs is around 4X stronger than your arms. So ultimately, the power is there.. You just need control :)
"Speed is nothing if you have no control" - Derek Roddy . . Or something like that LOL :)
fredzsMember
Since: Jan 07, 2003
Feb 08, 2006 12:59 am and to add.. I really dont use triggers when I record with my band.. I just seperate the Kick drum in one track and use C4 to add around 80hz for the low end.. take out the mids.. and add around 4000-6000 for that really clicky Triggered sound.. but it isnt really triggered.. just the sound :)
GeoffSM7b the Chuck Noris of Mic'sContributor
Since: Jun 20, 2002
Feb 08, 2006 01:36 am i cheat , i have an electric kit now and recording is a lot easier. Even thou practice is the way to go and that should be the key. Trigering is a great way to get that double kick down with out having sound off.
Noize2uCzar of MidiAdministrator
Since: Apr 04, 2002
Feb 09, 2006 09:35 pm Oh and I forgot one drummer who is very technical and proficiant with the double. Mike Portnoy of Dream Theatre is fantastic witht the double.
GregorMember
Since: Jan 08, 2004
Feb 09, 2006 09:56 pm Some drummers to listen to for double kick technique:
Raymond Herrera from Fear Factory
Van Williams from Nevermore
Nick Barker
Dave Lombardo
Gene Hoglan from Strapping young lad and Dark Angel
When I recorded this metal band the drummer had two different size kick drums so it was very difficult to get them to sound the same. Since a trigger we didn't have so we made the best of the situation. The best thing to do when recording double bass is to break the kit down to one kick with a double bass pedal if possible. Most drummers want two kicks but if you want consistency one kick is the way to go.
sticadokid*sticado: short and LOUD!*Member
Since: Feb 25, 2005
Feb 17, 2006 02:55 pm jason bittner is INSANE!!! him and joey r my favs.
ok btglenn,
i know what u mean. i play drums in my metal band and i record my band too but i know that its me (as the drummer) that's inconsistant. it took me about a year to get consistant at it. tell ur drummer to not play as hard when he's mic'd. aslo tell him to be thinking about his left foot (er, the weak one, thats my left) more than anything and he'll sub-conciously play that foot harder. and do jump ropes while bouncing on that foot w/ more weight then the other.
thats how i got even. hope i helped
LokiCone PokerMember
Since: Apr 07, 2002
Feb 17, 2006 05:16 pm Good ole dream theater. Noize seems like you and i have a lot of the same tastes in music. That's awesome. It was actually listening to dream theater that made me pick up the guitar. I stopped when i realized i sucked lol